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cab13367
06-09-2010, 04:39 PM
My brother just took delivery of a custom ordered new for 2010 X25. It's exactly the same length as the current LSV - 21'-6". He spec'd it with the 400 HP engine which seems like overkill, but it is rated to hold 16 people. It's got some nice features and others that I don't care for.

I am going to his lakehouse the first week of August for a week and can't wait to experience it for one whole week. It's suppose to have a sick wake with just stock ballast.

I don't have a pic of his exact boat but it's got all red gelcoat and he spec'd the mocha vinyl (baseball glove brown color) with red trim, which I don't particularly care for. It's certainly unique though. He got practically all the options including the built in video cam that tracks the rider and records to an SD card.

Does anyone on this forum boat on Council Grove City lake in Kansas? If so, you can't miss him.

Below are a couple links.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYeo9m_J8Ts

http://www.mastercraft.com/boats/overview/x25

viking
06-09-2010, 05:09 PM
WOW - nice boat!
It's a nice ride and probably costs a pretty PENNIE (or 2) :)

ibelonginprison
06-09-2010, 05:25 PM
I'd make out with it.....


I mean... awesome boat.

jmvotto
06-09-2010, 05:41 PM
Al, awesome.

let us know how it does comp to the LSV.

My buddy is getting a new x45 in two weeks so we should be able to check out the surf tabs and the monster wake. also i thin i can park my OBV in the main cabin LOL

tried to bring him to the SC side moomba or supra, but the pickle fork won out:evil: side

Ian Brantford
06-09-2010, 06:11 PM
He got practically all the options including the built in video cam that tracks the rider and records to an SD card.


I have been mulling over creating a tracking camera since I got my boat in 2005! The only thing that I found would work using anything other than a passive arm on the tow rope was a system created by a graduate student at Oxford, and that was for ocean rescue.

Can you tell me a bit about the Mastecraft's camera? Does it mechanically follow the rope, or is it a full motion-tracking system? Motion tracking on water is hard because the background changes rapidly and the object being tracked keeps changing in appearance.

jester
06-09-2010, 06:50 PM
Ian,

I am currently building a motion tracking system and I hope to have V1 finished by the end of next month depending on parts and some of my friends time. Nothing will attach to the rope and it will track the person in the water. I will post pic's and the video when it is finished and working.

jester
06-09-2010, 06:56 PM
Ian,

I was looking at the photo's of the Video camera and it looks like they extended up the ski rope holder and it moves with the rope. No arm but will only track the rope.

Ian Brantford
06-09-2010, 07:55 PM
Ian,

I am currently building a motion tracking system and I hope to have V1 finished by the end of next month depending on parts and some of my friends time. Nothing will attach to the rope and it will track the person in the water. I will post pic's and the video when it is finished and working.

Awesome. Do you have any resources on relevant machine vision systems? Most of the ones the I was able to find years ago pertained to industrial, security or teleconferencing systems. These were not at all adapted to tracking an object in water from a moving boat.

sandm
06-09-2010, 08:38 PM
just watched the vid. nice boat, but I bet it has a nice price to go along with it..

I have seen one of the motion cameras on a boat. it moves with the rope as it swivels with the rider. it's attached to the top of the rope hook on the tower.

you da man
06-09-2010, 09:01 PM
Al, awesome.

let us know how it does comp to the LSV.

My buddy is getting a new x45 in two weeks so we should be able to check out the surf tabs and the monster wake. also i thin i can park my OBV in the main cabin LOL

tried to bring him to the SC side moomba or supra, but the pickle fork won out:evil: side

I rode in a Mastercraft X-80 a couple months ago...twin engines, a bathroom, fridge, and sink.

Ian Brantford
06-09-2010, 09:14 PM
I have seen one of the motion cameras on a boat. it moves with the rope as it swivels with the rider. it's attached to the top of the rope hook on the tower.

I have seen some sample videos in the past, for systems that are mounted on the tower and mechanically follow the rope. I was not impressed. Any tower shake as the boat hits even modest wakes messed up the video. If the rider falls, there is more intense tower shake and then the camera stops tracking correctly because the rope goes slack.

The failure to track after a crash might not be an issue for expert riders who just want a record of their tricks. However, my boat has lots of beginners at various sports. The crashes are extremely entertaining. If the camera doesn't accurately capture 5-10 seconds following the crash, I cannot edit together a good video of the day.

I can see how modern stabilisation technology might smooth out the tower shake. However, there are limits to this. In addition, the high inter-frame compression that most consumer-grade cameras feature, having the camera in fast motion is a problem. I have put off buying a high-def camcorder because most consumer-grade ones use this compression and cannot reliably isolate passable-quality still shots from video sequences during editing. My Canon S2, which uses M-JPEG (a series of JPEG's with no interframe compression) yields better-quality stills of action shots, at only 640x480 pixels, than most modern camcorders.

I would rather have a motion-tracking system that is mounted near the back (say, on the pylon) and that simply aims whatever camera I want. If I have to put it together myself, so be it.

cab13367
06-10-2010, 01:12 AM
Here are some pics of my brother's actual X25.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs544.ash1/31809_1455410380935_1103598672_31388485_4567976_n. jpg

That's my brother enjoying the transom seat.
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs544.ash1/31809_1455410420936_1103598672_31388486_3569315_n. jpg

His old boat (a Crownline runabout) and the new X25. Yes, he is partial to red.
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs604.snc3/31809_1455410180930_1103598672_31388482_688120_n.j pg

One more. Good shot of the onboard pylon mounted camera.
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs544.ash1/31809_1455410780945_1103598672_31388492_6837623_n. jpg

cab13367
06-10-2010, 01:15 AM
Al, awesome.

let us know how it does comp to the LSV.

My buddy is getting a new x45 in two weeks so we should be able to check out the surf tabs and the monster wake. also i thin i can park my OBV in the main cabin LOL

tried to bring him to the SC side moomba or supra, but the pickle fork won out:evil: side

Funny, I was trying to talk him into an XLV GG or a Supra but he's a huge fan of the pickle fork so that's what drew him to MC. Yeah, I will definitely post up more pics as well as my impressions of the boat once I've spent a week with her.


just watched the vid. nice boat, but I bet it has a nice price to go along with it.

Yeah, I'm guessing he paid in the $80k range for it? That's just a WAG. You know he didn't get a great deal since he ordered it.

sandm
06-10-2010, 09:38 AM
I'm guessing he doesn't live anywhere real sunny and hot. I would think those seats, as nice as they are, will be scorching hot once out in the sun for a few hours?

very nice boat tho..

kaneboats
06-10-2010, 09:50 AM
I would think those seats, as nice as they are, will be scorching hot once out in the sun for a few hours?

I'm sure he keeps the A/C on to keep everything cool.

newty
06-10-2010, 10:27 AM
For the life of me I don't get the fiberglass fenders either. They look kinda gaycheese to me.
Boat is sexy though. I'd have gone all red no graphics and no red accents in the interior.
The X-25 is a really well thought out boat. I spent a lot of time at the one they had at the Portland Boatshow. Really a nice boat, especially for a new design.

KG's Supra24
06-10-2010, 12:31 PM
Up until this thread i always kinda laughed at myself for saying i like my boat and it is just as good as a MC. MC is the originator and the "king" of wakeboats is how i always felt but they are slipping fast in my book.

Simply my opinion and everyone is different but each time i see one i start liking my boat more and more. For instance ...

Not a fan of the giant X that supposed to look like someone cut it into the side of the boat? What is going on with the dash in your cluster of pictures and what the heck is with the steering wheel? I agree with the above comments on the trailer. I'm not real sure how that tower made it out of the drawing stage. I was a fan of the picklefork at first but it is wearing on me, especially when its on every boat from x1 to x99, and now that MB and Tige are doing it, it is loosing its appeal.

On a brighter side, the transom seat kicks some serious butt. That is cool. I am undecided on the seats. Nice idea but just makes it seem way more luxury (cobalt) than wakeboat.

Anways, still a kicka$$ boat (not trying to knock it). Just puttin my thoughts out there on MC and how they are making me feel great about my purchase everytime i see one. :)

jmvotto
06-10-2010, 12:31 PM
That x -25 is cool. he get the surf tabs too?

I can't wait to break in the boat and surf behind that monster

volfo
06-10-2010, 12:50 PM
I really like that boat. For a long time, all MC seemed to offer was a boat very similar to a moomba, with a ton of chrome, silly looking wraps, crazy speakers designed to make you the enemy of everyone on the lake, and all at a price whereby you could buy two or more "similar" moombas.

This boat, however, has some really nice features. I looked at it and thought, wow, maybe I would consider a mastercraft. There are real, nice, substantive features built into this boat that me and my family and my friends would appreciate, whether cruising the lake, wakeboarding, tubing, relaxing and swimming, or learning to surf. All things we regularly do and enjoy on our moomba (except surfing because I just can't bring myself to put bags all over teh floor of my family boat).

Then I did a search for the price. According to a thread on wakeworld, they had one at the Seattle Boat Show for $116,500 with a boat show discount of $4,500 for a total of $112k. The dealer bragged that he sold it for that price. Someone said the MSRP is $78,800 for that boat, plus options, and someone said the trailer was an $8,000 option. I'm sorry, for $112k I could buy a new XLV to wake behind, an OB to ski behind, two new hydrohoist lifts and a reaosnable 2 year old tow vehicle. I could almost buy 3 new leftover LSVs if I looked hard enough and bargained hard enough. Apparently there was one at the Portland Boat show less loaded for $75k. Still ridiculous.

Moomba, please don't follow suit. There is a reason that the LSV is the best selling wakeboard boat. To paraphrase a political debate: "it's the price stupid" My 2001 Moomba is a nice boat. Not perfect, but nice. The 2010s are way better. Moomba, keep making quality boats with quality components. Consider functional innovations like lounge seating and expanded swim platforms and more storage if and when you can build it in at a reasonable price structure. When I replace my boat, I will look at Moomba first. I may also peruse a vride or a centurion, but last I did, I preferred the price/value/quality proposition of the moomba. I probably will next time, too.

I also wonder why, when you see these prices, quality I/O manufacturers like Sea Ray, Chapparral, etc. don't throw a v-drive in their big deck boats. I know there is more to it than that, and those boats are expensive too, but the big MCs are starting to look like a Sea Ray sundeck with a Vdrive in my opinion. I know they had ski rays in the past, but the hull/inside design of a wakeboard/wakesurf boat are far more compatable with a typical wake boat than a competition ski boat.

KG's Supra24
06-10-2010, 01:24 PM
This boat, however, has some really nice features. I looked at it and thought, wow, maybe I would consider a mastercraft. There are real, nice, substantive features built into this boat that me and my family and my friends would appreciate, whether cruising the lake, wakeboarding, tubing, relaxing and swimming, or learning to surf. All things we regularly do and enjoy on our moomba (except surfing because I just can't bring myself to put bags all over teh floor of my family boat).



Features such as? I havent looked in depth too much but would love to hear the little things that i dont know about.

What Moomba do you have? Vdrive? The ballast moomba/supra has makes it super easy to get more weight, plenty for surfing. I run 2500 lbs surfing without one bag being visible or taking up space. I have a big boat but any v drive could run the same (or close to) the same amount.

Do the surf tabs allow the pickleforks to throw a good surf? From what i have read, you can't get a great surf wake from any of the pickleforks. Not trying to be too negative, just what i have read.

brain_rinse
06-10-2010, 02:02 PM
KG and volfo collectively said most everything I was going to say. I love some things like the rear seating, surf tabs, interior layout/storage, bow seating/armrests, and most importantly the super deep CSX 220 hull! There are plenty of things I could nitpick (like that tower, ugh) but in the end it's the pricing that puts this boat so far out of the realm of possibility that I'm not sure why I even bother having an opinion on it. :)

moombadaze
06-10-2010, 02:33 PM
Al, make sure and tell us more about the surftabs when you get a chance.

lots to like, lots to not like, but the price just kills it for me

viking
06-10-2010, 02:35 PM
Yeah, I'm guessing he paid in the $80k range for it? That's just a WAG. You know he didn't get a great deal since he ordered it.

You could get a small house for that!
But what fun would that be:)

cab13367
06-10-2010, 04:19 PM
Guys, this is turning into a real interesting thread. Thanks for the dialogue. Below are some replies to some of the comments:


I'm guessing he doesn't live anywhere real sunny and hot. I would think those seats, as nice as they are, will be scorching hot once out in the sun for a few hours?

Actually, he does live someplace where it gets sunny and hot in the summer - Kansas! And his boat sits out in the sun tied to the dock until it's time for the next session so it surprises me too that he opted for a dark interior.


I'm sure he keeps the A/C on to keep everything cool.

Yeah, probably has heated and cooled seats like some of the fancy cars these days!


The X-25 is a really well thought out boat. I spent a lot of time at the one they had at the Portland Boatshow.
Do you remember the asking price on that boat?


Not a fan of the giant X that supposed to look like someone cut it into the side of the boat? What is going on with the dash in your cluster of pictures and what the heck is with the steering wheel?


Well, you are never going to please everyone no matter what decal you put on a boat. And some people will just remove them anyway :). Also, I think wakeboats have evolved into very extroverted craft compared to the more subtle and understated stern drive segment. So the loud decals and the in your face bling elements (such as the steering wheel) are all in keeping with that extroverted image. I personally like the more understated road which is more in line with my personality.


That x -25 is cool. he get the surf tabs too?


Yes, he did get the surf tabs. Since this boat only has 200 lbs in each rear locker (and 400 in the ski locker) it's going to need something to make it list more than just the 200 lbs.


I really like that boat. For a long time, all MC seemed to offer was a boat very similar to a moomba, with a ton of chrome, silly looking wraps, crazy speakers designed to make you the enemy of everyone on the lake, and all at a price whereby you could buy two or more "similar" moombas.

This boat, however, has some really nice features. I looked at it and thought, wow, maybe I would consider a mastercraft. There are real, nice, substantive features built into this boat that me and my family and my friends would appreciate, whether cruising the lake, wakeboarding, tubing, relaxing and swimming, or learning to surf. All things we regularly do and enjoy on our moomba (except surfing because I just can't bring myself to put bags all over teh floor of my family boat).

Then I did a search for the price. According to a thread on wakeworld, they had one at the Seattle Boat Show for $116,500 with a boat show discount of $4,500 for a total of $112k. The dealer bragged that he sold it for that price. Someone said the MSRP is $78,800 for that boat, plus options, and someone said the trailer was an $8,000 option. I'm sorry, for $112k I could buy a new XLV to wake behind, an OB to ski behind, two new hydrohoist lifts and a reaosnable 2 year old tow vehicle. I could almost buy 3 new leftover LSVs if I looked hard enough and bargained hard enough. Apparently there was one at the Portland Boat show less loaded for $75k. Still ridiculous.

Moomba, please don't follow suit. There is a reason that the LSV is the best selling wakeboard boat. To paraphrase a political debate: "it's the price stupid" My 2001 Moomba is a nice boat. Not perfect, but nice. The 2010s are way better. Moomba, keep making quality boats with quality components. Consider functional innovations like lounge seating and expanded swim platforms and more storage if and when you can build it in at a reasonable price structure. When I replace my boat, I will look at Moomba first. I may also peruse a vride or a centurion, but last I did, I preferred the price/value/quality proposition of the moomba. I probably will next time, too.

I also wonder why, when you see these prices, quality I/O manufacturers like Sea Ray, Chapparral, etc. don't throw a v-drive in their big deck boats. I know there is more to it than that, and those boats are expensive too, but the big MCs are starting to look like a Sea Ray sundeck with a Vdrive in my opinion. I know they had ski rays in the past, but the hull/inside design of a wakeboard/wakesurf boat are far more compatable with a typical wake boat than a competition ski boat.

I'm with you, volfo. The Moomba is the wakeboard boat for the people. If the Moomba brand did not exist, I would not have been able to buy a new wakeboat. I hope they continue to keep the price down and resist the temptation to increase the bling and the price to go with it. The customer can always add the bling he wants. Continue to provide us with just what we need and we will add the other stuff ourselves.


and most importantly the super deep CSX 220 hull!

That's the most significant thing for me two is that it has a deep vee. But I have to believe that increases the minimum planing/clean wake speed which is one of the things I like most about my LSV. Giving it a deep vee seems like it makes it closer to a stern drive but I guess as long as the vee is shallow at the tail end, that's what matters. But I'm no hull engineer.

cab13367
06-10-2010, 04:32 PM
Here are some of my likes and dislikes based on viewing the video and not seeing it person yet:

Transom seats. Nice novelty idea but hate the fact that it results in a very small opening to access the rear lockers. You basically have to lift the whole sun deck now to get at something not immediatley below the access hole. Which means making everyone get off it. You can sit on the sun pad just as easily :). I could see how people will sit in them though while someone is surfing even though it's illegal to do so.

Gas struts for all the seat cushions. That's a nice feature over having to remove them and set them aside.

Armrest in the bow. Absolutely superfluous in my mind. Who needs an armrest and why?? If you were going to sit there for hours at a time, then okay but who does that?

Ballast system. Comes with 200 lb hard tanks in each rear locker plus 400 lbs in the ski locker. Why only 200 lbs?? This is why I don't like hard tanks. I would rip them out and put in fat sacs so I can have the weight in there that I want. My bro is going to have the dealer add a couple of fat sacs and they are going to somehow plumb them in to the existing system. Might as well rip out the hard tanks and go with single fat sacs if you're going to do that.

Love the deep vee design but only if it doesn't compromise minimum planing/clean wake speed as I pull women and children who like to wakeboard at slow speeds (16-18 mph).

Snap out carpets. Nice feature to have if you have a place to hang and dry the carpet after each use which I don't but he does.

Picke fork bow. Additional seating is always nice and the pickle fork does that without adding length to the boat. Plus I like the way it looks over the copy cats out there.

Anyway, those are my initial thoughts. I'll report back once I've had chance to see it in person and ride behind it.

sandm
06-10-2010, 04:47 PM
cab, I agree with everything you have just posted. my first thought when I saw the guy riding on the back was the ticket I would be paying at our lake. they are pretty liberal at letting people ride on the back, but that's pushing..

it's a very nice boat, and for the coin, it should be. I'm sure the build quality is above anything skiers offers, but in the end, it's still just a boat..

the only thing I wish skiers would take away from all of these threads and boats is the snap-in carpet. I am dreading the day I have to replace mine. it looks like it's going to be a MAJOR PITA to even attempt..

edit-I do like the gas struts on the cushions as I am always afraid to lose one towing, but on my supra, when you fold the tower down, it rests on the seats, so I remove them to keep the imprints from becoming permanent, so I'll keep the removable seatcushions. that and much easier to clean on the workbench :)

cab13367
06-10-2010, 09:59 PM
edit-I do like the gas struts on the cushions as I am always afraid to lose one towing, but on my supra, when you fold the tower down, it rests on the seats, so I remove them to keep the imprints from becoming permanent, so I'll keep the removable seatcushions. that and much easier to clean on the workbench :)

Yeah, on second thought, the seat cushions on my last boat had piano hinges on them so they were a pain to keep clean. Gunk would accummulate around the hinges so every once in a while, I would unscrew the hinges so I could clean underneath them. The removable cushions makes cleaning a snap.

Sled491
06-13-2010, 06:36 PM
Very sharp boat, what I take away from all this is that there is some one out there still doing well in this economy :D

wolfeman131
06-13-2010, 11:27 PM
wow, that is quite a ride! congrats to your bro'.

sailing217
06-14-2010, 10:23 AM
X-25 in Cincy boat show sold at sticker $85k (with trailer). Loaded up but I think only 350hp engine

The manual rope following camera hooked to an SD card in the glove box is a $1500 option. My dealer said some aftermarket companies can do it for $800.

Sled491
06-14-2010, 10:33 AM
Gotta love technology, wonder how shaky the pic is. Every weekend we ski some one is always trying to exlpain what the other guy was doing wrong, video is such an awsum tool. Also keeps every one honest in the boat :D

jmvotto
06-20-2010, 11:53 PM
Al,my buddy got his x 45 delivered one week early, spent part of Dad's day checking it out and kids swimming from it . That boat is freakin awesome. Not sure but the JL system on those MC sounds great, close to the HLCD's maybe better... .

Still in the break in mode though of altering rpm's for the first 10 hours.. should get to ride behing in soon, next couple of weeks and get to check the vid cam and the surf tabs..

cab13367
08-13-2010, 02:15 AM
I got back on Monday after spending 10 days at my brother's lakehouse. We boarded and surfed behind his 2010 Mastercraft X25 every day (and got on the air chair one day), usually a couple sessions per day. So this is my review of his boat.

Although his boat is the same length as my LSV, 21-6", his boat weighs 1000 lbs more - 4,370 vs 3300! So the first thing I noticed is that his wakeboarding wake with no ballast is about the same size as my wake with full ballast (1300 lbs). With full ballast (1800 lbs), his wake is huge!

See the sequence below showing the size of the wake and how much air you can get behind it. This is with full ballast (1800lbs), 20 mph. The rider is an employee at the MC dealer that was supposed to give us a wakeboard clinic (came free with the boat purchase) but in reality, he was just a 20 year old who rides a lot. He was a decent boarder but couldn't teach to save his life.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/DSC_8162.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/DSC_8163.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/DSC_8164.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/DSC_8165.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 02:16 AM
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/DSC_8166.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 02:25 AM
Since this boat has the pickle fork which means the hull resembles a tri-hull, it is very difficult to get the boat to list. It has surf tabs (two trim tabs on either side of the wakeplate) that move together in opposite directions to try and help the boat list but I don't think it does a whole lot. Because the boat is so heavy, the end result is still a pretty good size wave but we could never get it to clean up. See pics below.

Here you can see the "tri-hull" underneath the pickle fork bow making it difficult to make the boat list.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8727.jpg

Here are a couple pics of the wave with my 14 year old son on it. You can see how little the boat is listing. This is with 700lbs in the port side rear locker and 400 in the front.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8738.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8737.jpg

newty
08-13-2010, 02:27 AM
That guy looks like he's 4' nothing next to that wave. That wave looks huge! How fast are you guys going.
I never noticed the hull from the front. Al your surf wake looks awesome compared to that. The surf wake would be a deal killer for me. Looks like you guys had a good time non the less.

cab13367
08-13-2010, 02:32 AM
The ballast system consists of 250lb hard tanks under the floor of each rear locker and 400 lbs in a hard tank under the front seats. There is no ski locker in the walkway like there is in my LSV. Then, my brother had an X2 sac (455lbs) piggybacked on top of each the tank. The pumps are similar to the new LSV's (Jabsco's on timers). The rear lockers are very short and so 705 per corner is all that will fit.

Here are some general pics of the boat.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8746.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084844.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084845.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084851.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 02:44 AM
With rear deck filler cushion in:
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084856.jpg

Removable ski pylon, synthetic teak inlay in behind it:
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084852.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084853.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084855.jpg

newty
08-13-2010, 02:50 AM
That interior is beautiful! Love that caramel.

cab13367
08-13-2010, 02:50 AM
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084846.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084848.jpg

Seat cushions are hinged and on struts. The storage under the port lounge seat is huge and deep. Can easily put a couple of surfboards or wakeboards in there.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084869.jpg

Teak swim platform is standard. Teak on the engine cover is a synthethic inlay.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8748.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 02:56 AM
Integrated windblock.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084894.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084895.jpg

Racks swivel 360 degrees. Just pull down on the handles to lock the boards in place.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084901.jpg

These little arms push down on the board and lock them in place.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084902.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 03:28 AM
My brother ordered the big engine - 6 liter, 400 HP.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084858.jpg

Automatic fire extinguisher.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084859.jpg

Teak swim platform was standard but my brother wanted one with a retractable ladder so he ordered a second, fiberglass platform.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084866.jpg

Blower vent:
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084867.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 03:39 AM
The "rumble seat" as I like to call it.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084865.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084864.jpg
Head unit is a Clarion that plays DVD's on it's small screen and also sends the feed to the bigger screen at the helm.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084880.jpg
Amps are JL Audio M6600 and M4400.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084872.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 03:42 AM
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8749.jpg
This puck controls the LCD screen and the Perfect Pass.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8754.jpg
Note the heated seat switch (driver as well as observer's seat are heated).
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8750.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8753.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 03:49 AM
Trim tab switches (there are three trim tabs), ballast switches, and tower light switches.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/IMG_8752.jpg

The pics below are out of focus - the LCD screen is actually very sharp.

LCD displaying air temp, water temp, water depth, etc.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084886.jpg

LCD displaying trim tab positions and ballast fill levels.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084887.jpg

LCD displaying trim tab positions, ballast fill levels, and perfect pass setting and speed.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084889.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 03:56 AM
Probably my favorite feature. You can display the tower camera feed on the LCD screen so you can see your rider at all times then hit the record button to record the video onto a memory card.. Unfortunately, the camera has no zooming capability so it's a little too zoomed in for surfing, a little too zoomed out for wakeboarding.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/photo.jpg

Transom mounted siwtches for transom shower, underwater lights, and boot juice squirter. This boat is loaded!
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084862.jpg

Transom stereo remote.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084863.jpg

Transom hot water shower.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084906.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 03:57 AM
That's it for tonight, more tomorrow.

cab13367
08-13-2010, 05:32 AM
That guy looks like he's 4' nothing next to that wave. That wave looks huge! How fast are you guys going.
I never noticed the hull from the front. Al your surf wake looks awesome compared to that. The surf wake would be a deal killer for me. Looks like you guys had a good time non the less.

Yeah, pictures don't do the wake justice. We are going about 20 mph. Yeah, I was disapponted at the surf wave although it has a lot more push than it looks.

deerfield
08-13-2010, 08:51 AM
cab - Fantastic job with the pictures. Thanks. - Deerfield

lewisb13
08-13-2010, 08:54 AM
THat boat is RI-diculous.

romoboco
08-13-2010, 09:07 AM
Truthfully now Al what did you like/dislike?

Sled491
08-13-2010, 09:44 AM
Holy crap, he has 98 hrs already? That's nuts!!!

My ski buddy on my lake just bought a 197 TT edition. I have to say that while the ski wake seems just average to me the MC people know how to put a boat together. I mean there is a rubber inset floor with a drain port for the driver, so that when you come in and switch drivers you don't get the carpet all wet. I can't describe it but there dash is just so well put together and elegant looking. I don't wnat to start comparing it to my Outback, but while I've always loved my boat and it was what I could afford, all boats are not created equal is all I have to say.

zegm
08-13-2010, 10:25 AM
Man has MasterCraft come a long way since my 1975 Stars and Stripes. The quality was there back then but is way just a hull with the only feature comfort being the glove box. But again for a boat to last 35 years and to bring me 4500 dollars when I sold it says a lot. I have to believe that all of those options has to be one big reason they cost so much. Now if only they would scale back on some of those options they could sell a boat within the "normal" persons price range. I mean it is kind of late for me or MrsZ to being going to Med school! :D

jmvotto
08-13-2010, 10:26 AM
Al,

The x-25 is awesome. Takes a while to learn all the gadgets when you drive . your bro loaded his as well as my buddies '10 x45. could not believe not only a heater but heated seats,:rolleyes: shower, the extra plug and play ballast. the under water led lights, etc etc, etc. How did the ballast system work. my friend keeps burning up impellars on the starboard side. may have gotten a bad pump.

The wakeboard wake is just down right intimidating:p

cab13367
08-13-2010, 03:49 PM
Battery switch and VSR are standard.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084874.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084873.jpg

Tower mounted camera, rear facing lights, and two of the 4 JL speaker pods.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084899.jpg

The speaker pods have forward facing lights built in.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084898.jpg

Sled491
08-13-2010, 04:00 PM
To tell you the truth I'd be just plain scared to own that boat. Sooooo many little things to keep clean and keep track of. I mean unless you had the means to turn your boat over every couple years I could see it turning into a giant headache. My boat sits on a lift about 7 mnths a year. Yeah I clean it with Babes and such, but as for getting all the nooks and cranies clean that has to wait until I take it out for the season. I big boat like that with all the bling would just drive me crazy on how to keep it looking nice.

cab13367
08-13-2010, 04:28 PM
No doubt, this is a sic, sic boat but it comes at a sic, sic price. Let's just say that the sticker on this boat as equipped is well over $100k. It's a lot of coin for a toy but if you can afford it, and you have a lakehouse that you spend every weekend at plus several full weeks per summer, then why not. And my brother is a gadget geek so the boat fits him to a tee.

Bill asked what I liked and disliked about the boat.

My likes are:
Very roomy cabiin for a 21-1/2 footer, but at the expense of the rear storage compartments.
16 person capacity
Awesome wakeboarding wake even with no ballast. Absolutely huge with ballast.
Very deep hull and interior yet planes out at a suprisingly low speed. Without ballast, the wake was clean at 19 mph and 70' and with 1800 lbs of ballast, it was clean at 21 mph. GPS verified. Impressive for a deep V hull and 4370lb boat (before ballast).
Ability to view the rider from the helm and record his/her session on video at the push of a button. But it needs a zooming function even if it's a manual one.
The 360 degree swiveling board racks with lock down levers.
LCD screen showing ballast levels, etc. Also, the ability to store rider preferences including trim tab position, ballast level, and speed. Just push one button and everything is set up for that specific rider.
Anchor compartment on the nose of the boat.

My dislikes are:
When all ballasts are full (1800lbs), the boat struggles to get up on plane even with the 400hp motor and a 14.75x15.5 prop and only a few people on board. He definitely needs a new prop but I'm not sure if it will make enough of a difference.
The rumble seats are a nice novelty but it takes up valuable storage space. I would rather have the storage space.
Only four cabin speakers - two in the bow, two in the lounge.
"Tri-hull"design makes it impossible to create a clean surf wake.
Price - it's god awful expensive! You can buy nearly three Moomba LSV's for the price of this boat!!
I was dismayed at the quality issues that he is seeing, such as:
The tower shakes and rattles a lot and it even has the brace that they added at the top corners of the tower. Very disappointing for this expensive a boat.
The tower camera. It already quit once and was replaced and while I was out there, a plastic piece that allowed the camera to track with the rope broke so it would only track one direction but not the other (see pic below).
The upholstery is already showing lots of wear after two months and one seat cushion is warped pretty bad (see pics below).
The bimini fabric is very lose as delivered from the factory.
One of the heater hoses was crushed between the upper and lower halves of the boat when it was put together. You would think they would catch that and fix it. They didn't.

So in conclusion, this is a very expensive boat but it does come with a lot of features we don't have on our boats. Does the price justify these features? That's for the consumer to decide on their own. The quality is disappointing considering the price though. Wakeboarding wake is awesome, surf wake not so much. Very heavy boat results in sluggish performance despite the big engine. The pickle fork bow is nice but seriously compromises the surf wake.

Note duct tape on camera base after part of the plastic base broke off.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084900.jpg

The pics below show the wear on just one cushion and there are alot of places where the upholstery is showing wear already. My brother correctly points out, if it's like this after just two months, what's it going to look like after two years? I pull the cushions off after every use like he does to wipe them down but after 3-1/2 seasons, mine show NO signs of wear. I find this unacceptable.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084878.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084876.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084875.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 04:29 PM
Pic of warped cushion:
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084879.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 04:39 PM
Holy crap, he has 98 hrs already? That's nuts!!!

My ski buddy on my lake just bought a 197 TT edition. I have to say that while the ski wake seems just average to me the MC people know how to put a boat together. I mean there is a rubber inset floor with a drain port for the driver, so that when you come in and switch drivers you don't get the carpet all wet. I can't describe it but there dash is just so well put together and elegant looking. I don't wnat to start comparing it to my Outback, but while I've always loved my boat and it was what I could afford, all boats are not created equal is all I have to say.

Actually, 98 is the percent of fuel in the tank. 82.2 is the hours. But either way, yes, it's a lot of hours but that's because he uses the boat. He didn't buy it as a trophy to show off.

Yeah, it has a lot of those nice features but they do command a price for them.

I personally am thankful that the Moomba line exists so that those of us with more modest incomes can afford a tournament quality boarding and surfing experience but without all the other bells and whistles.

cab13367
08-13-2010, 04:43 PM
Al,

The x-25 is awesome. Takes a while to learn all the gadgets when you drive . your bro loaded his as well as my buddies '10 x45. could not believe not only a heater but heated seats,:rolleyes: shower, the extra plug and play ballast. the under water led lights, etc etc, etc. How did the ballast system work. my friend keeps burning up impellars on the starboard side. may have gotten a bad pump.

The wakeboard wake is just down right intimidating:p

The ballast system worked fine, he has not burned up an impeller yet. He did not get the plug and play ballast because his dealer didn't know about it when my brother was ordering the boat (the dealer is proving to be pretty clueless about their product). I didn't like the fact that you never knew if the tanks are empty so we kept hitting the empty switch again after it timed out.

viking
08-13-2010, 04:54 PM
I don't know about anybody else but if I paid that kinda money for a boat it better be bulletproof. I would go insane with the seat wear like that. I baby my boat and it's cheap in comparison. I can't imagine.

Seems to me there's a hefty premium people pay for the Mastercraft name (i know i know) although there are alot of gadget that I'm really impressed with.

I think I'll pocket the extra 75 g's and keep mine. You can do alot with that kinda money :)

stretch55
08-13-2010, 05:03 PM
Al great job on the review! I think you could make a career out of doing this LOL!! Personally If I had the funds available to buy a "high end" boat I would buy a Malibu over a Mastercraft any day of the week. Personally I think they look better, perform better, built better and a smidget cheaper. But that's just my opinion.

Fman
08-13-2010, 06:37 PM
I dont care who you are, thats a beautiful boat! although, it would be a toss up for me between the X-25 and Launch 242! both are sweeeet....

Fman
08-13-2010, 06:44 PM
MC Towers look nice, but I agree, they are junk.... my brother in law has an X-15 and it wobbles like crazy. He added some stabilizer brackets for the corners because they were bending.

The upholstry wear on the X-25 looks like abuse from passengers, dont know if you can consider it a wear problem on MC's end. If I was the dealer and someone brought me back that boat I would tell them to learn how to teach people not to abuse the inside. The tears/slices are from something cuting into it. At least thats what I see from the pics.

cab13367
08-13-2010, 07:11 PM
MC Towers look nice, but I agree, they are junk.... my brother in law has an X-15 and it wobbles like crazy. He added some stabilizer brackets for the corners because they were bending.

The upholstry wear on the X-25 looks like abuse from passengers, dont know if you can consider it a wear problem on MC's end. If I was the dealer and someone brought me back that boat I would tell them to learn how to teach people not to abuse the inside. The tears/slices are from something cuting into it. At least thats what I see from the pics.

Fman,

See the seat cushion in the corner in the pic below? The pics of the tears is on the sides of that cushion. So the wear you see can't have been caused by passengers because they are on the side of the cushion and are up against gelcoat when the cushions are in place. I looked for anything sharp that might be causing it and couldn't see anything. I agree though that it looks like abuse but I don't think that's the case. There are also wear marks were the cushions open and close and rub against each other. His other boat, a Crownline, does not show this kind of wear and he has had it for about 5 years now and it was used the same way as the MC.

Al

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/X25/P8084846.jpg

cab13367
08-13-2010, 07:19 PM
That interior is beautiful! Love that caramel.

It's Mocha :) Yeah, I love it too.

Razzman
08-13-2010, 07:55 PM
The tower and vinyl issues are complaints MC has had for years, and they still can't get it right. I looked at the X-25 at the boat show and wasn't impressed at all. I could visually see flaws that, for the price, should not be there. And why MC still insists on that diamond stitch pattern is beyond me? I will gaurantee it will start coming out soon, it's also another complaint of MC owners. I look at that boat and just can't see it holding up with a boat load of kids, glad i have a Moomba.

wolfeman131
08-13-2010, 11:19 PM
Great write up Al. That boat looks great, I like the gadgets, but sure would be disappointed with the wear/warping the seats are showing as well as the other issues your bro is having.

jmvotto
08-14-2010, 08:06 AM
The ballast system worked fine, he has not burned up an impeller yet. He did not get the plug and play ballast because his dealer didn't know about it when my brother was ordering the boat (the dealer is proving to be pretty clueless about their product). I didn't like the fact that you never knew if the tanks are empty so we kept hitting the empty switch again after it timed out.

Al, the MC vsion screen has a menu to show if the hard tanks are empty, pretty cool, not sure how accurate, but the Plug and play saoft sacs you have to visually inspect to full draining before going to the hard tank draining.

may be surfing it tomorrow, i read somewhere that the x25,x 45 surf wake sweet spot is further back almost to the end of a surf rope. since i acn't find it yet, can you comfirm or deny that rumor.

fyi i would have some serioud warrnty issues with those seats....:evil:

sandm
08-14-2010, 12:34 PM
great writeup. loved the pics of the entire boat, not just overall shots..

interesting if you note the condition of the transom remote and switches. they look corroded and the gel looks very waterspotted. guess looking at that, I would expect some wear issues inside since it is apparent that this is not a "trophy" boat but one that gets used..

Fman
08-14-2010, 01:39 PM
Al,

I cant see what you are talking about in the pics, looks like a tear/nick in the top part of the seat???? Cant really see the wear on the side cushions in the picture.

Regardless, that is a beautiful boat, I am a big fan of Mastercraft boats, I really think they build a quality boat. I am sure for 100k they will warranty any items that are not holding up properly. The wakeboard wake looks real nice as well.

Congrats to your brother, one hell of a boat he has there.... thumbs up for me!

cab13367
08-14-2010, 02:49 PM
Al, the MC vsion screen has a menu to show if the hard tanks are empty, pretty cool, not sure how accurate, but the Plug and play saoft sacs you have to visually inspect to full draining before going to the hard tank draining.

may be surfing it tomorrow, i read somewhere that the x25,x 45 surf wake sweet spot is further back almost to the end of a surf rope. since i acn't find it yet, can you comfirm or deny that rumor.

fyi i would have some serioud warrnty issues with those seats....:evil:

Joe, I am aware that there is a screen showing the tank level but my brother doesn't believe it to be very accurate.

The surf wake is steep and the pocket is pretty short and close to the boat and the top of the wave is foamy. The pocket is definitely not as far back as the end of the surf rope. My surf wake is clean on top, the locket is longer, and I think is comparable in height.

cab13367
08-14-2010, 02:52 PM
great writeup. loved the pics of the entire boat, not just overall shots..

interesting if you note the condition of the transom remote and switches. they look corroded and the gel looks very waterspotted. guess looking at that, I would expect some wear issues inside since it is apparent that this is not a "trophy" boat but one that gets used..

They are not corroded. When I took the pics, the boat had been in the water continuously for about two weeks so yeah, it's pretty waterspotted.

cab13367
08-14-2010, 02:58 PM
Al,

I cant see what you are talking about in the pics, looks like a tear/nick in the top part of the seat???? Cant really see the wear on the side cushions in the picture.

Regardless, that is a beautiful boat, I am a big fan of Mastercraft boats, I really think they build a quality boat. I am sure for 100k they will warranty any items that are not holding up properly. The wakeboard wake looks real nice as well.

Congrats to your brother, one hell of a boat he has there.... thumbs up for me!

The reason for the pic is to show u that the areas of wear that I posted are on the sides of the corner seat cushion so they are not subject to wear from passengers. The parts that are exposed are actually holding up fine.

Yes, they should cover these things under warranty but u wonder if the new cushions will fare any better.

Agreed, it's a beautiful boat, just a little disappointing that he is seeing so many quality issues. Just goes to show I guess that expensive boats are not without their problems.

Sled491
08-16-2010, 05:16 PM
Al I would agree. Just because you pay more doesn't mean it is put together by better people. I think for the money you are getting a whole crap load of bling and features that we just don't get to see on our boats, but as I said that certainly doesn't mean they are put together better.

squeeg333
08-16-2010, 07:10 PM
Al, great write up man. Amazing boat. I really do like that Mocha too, and the red accentuates it well.

It's dissapointing though that it's not holding up like you'd expect it to, especially for paying that much. Typcially, you see a guy drop 120K on a boat, and just figure he's got money to burn, and may not necessarily take care of his stuff like he should, because money grows on trees. It's apparent, at least from the descriptions from his other boat, and he does take care of his stuff. Money may still grow on trees for him (and good for him for sure!!), but it's just sad that it's already showing signs of wear. I would be super dissapointed (as I am sure your brother is).

It's still a sick boat though, and I suppose if I had the money, and the opportunity, I might do the same thing.

I really enjoyed the write up Al, nice work. I can see many pros and cons about that boat, and you touched on a ton of them.