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BadbluSi
01-08-2011, 01:32 PM
Ok I'm currently in the market for some tower speakers, and have been trying do my research by reading up till I'm nauseous!! I've looked at Wetsounds packages (double up and 3 some), I've also considered 4 6x9's looking at offerings from Wetsounds and Polk and would do a Liquid trends box. I want to be somewhat cost conscious but still have great sound. I just bought the boat last summer (2000 Supra Santera) and right now would say it's a 70/30 split with partying in the coves and riding. I replaced the cabin speakers w 4 Polk Db651's and really like them so far. I want something that is more in the middle, not killing passengers in the boat but good for the days were anchored and tied up with friends. I think that some of the Wetsounds combos or HLCD might be overkill for what we currently do. Thoughts or suggestions, not trying to start a what's best argument, just looking for some expert advice.

cab13367
01-08-2011, 02:29 PM
I would definitely look into the Exile SXT65's powered by the Exile Harpoon amp. The SXT65's are a smooth sounding, non-HLCD speaker so they sound great up close, and because the Harpoon delivers 1000W rms (250W rms per speaker), they can still play loud enough to clearly hear while wakeboarding.

This is the set up I run and I am very happy with it. I do more surfing and hanging out on the boat than wakeboarding so sound quality is more important to me that maximum volume and projection so it serves our needs perfectly.

Al

BadbluSi
01-08-2011, 02:32 PM
How do they compare price wise to the WS 696's?

Brianinpdx
01-08-2011, 02:42 PM
BadBlu -

Your points are well taken about not starting a speaker brand war. I definitely have a dog in the fight so I'll try to give you some impartial information.

HLCD's are aimed at driving sound way back into the wakeboarder at 80ft and beyond. It doesnt matter the brand persay, its a matter of technology. The upside is just that...it gets the sound way back there. The downside is they sound ULTRA crisp for people in the boat and on the swim deck.

Direct Radiating speakers will offer you a middle ground of sorts. They are going to sound great up close for the people in the boat, and fantastic for the surfer at 20 feet... but will drop off from there. "Cab" was actually one of our local customers that took the time to demo our HLCD design and then also our non HLCD design. He's probably one of a dozen guys out there on the planet that took the time to do two installs and take it to the water and let the real world decide. If you do decide to go down the non HLCD path, I'd suggest doubling up with 2 pairs so you get decent sound out at a wakeboarder and fill up your tower at the same time.

Lastly, whatever brand of speaker you choose, make sure you have ample power on tap for the tower setup. Dont spend your money on a great tower speaker only to point 25W of power at them... Trust me, I've seen it done and the results are ugly.

If you need any Exile information, shoot me a PM and I'll help ya out.

Cheers,

-Brian
Exile Audio

BadbluSi
01-08-2011, 03:16 PM
So Brian, it sounds like an HLCD set up is more for the rider than in cabin guests? If I read correctly than finding something in the middle would be more of what I'm looking for. Brian does Exile have a 6x9 offering?

sandm
01-08-2011, 03:53 PM
just my .02. tower speakers should be designed for the riders of the boat. non-hlcd's if you are a surfer and hlcd's if you board/ski a lot. if you have a well-designed system with enough power as brian suggests, you really don't need tower speakers when you are just chillin. when we are at the dock, I usually have the bullets on the tower turned off and just use the 6 db651's in the boat for sound. given enough juice, they will do just fine for the 50ft or so that you may be floating/swimming around the boat :)

whatever you decide to do, exile does have some good stuff, and check out earmark as well for some other options. neither one will steer you wrong..

cab13367
01-08-2011, 04:34 PM
just my .02. tower speakers should be designed for the riders of the boat. non-hlcd's if you are a surfer and hlcd's if you board/ski a lot. if you have a well-designed system with enough power as brian suggests, you really don't need tower speakers when you are just chillin. when we are at the dock, I usually have the bullets on the tower turned off and just use the 6 db651's in the boat for sound. given enough juice, they will do just fine for the 50ft or so that you may be floating/swimming around the boat :)

whatever you decide to do, exile does have some good stuff, and check out earmark as well for some other options. neither one will steer you wrong..

Problem with this as we usually have some people in the boat as well as some floating/swimming behind it so if I turn just the in boat speakers up for the people in the water, then I am blasting out the people in the boat. So I usually fade it about 75/25 tower/inboats when we are anchored.

EarmarkMarine
01-08-2011, 04:53 PM
Badblu,
Pertaining to Wetsounds, since that was the tower brand mentioned in the OP...You did not mention the Wetsounds Pro485 as a stand alone option. The Pro485 is the best that Wetsounds has to offer. It has a slightly larger pod displacement per each driver and continuous midbass cones for greater surface area which generates more midbass output and bass extension. It has a fully developed horn with a substantially more powerful compression driver. Everything including the crossover is more robust. The Pro485 has a smoother response which is what you are looking for in close range listening or at rest. The Pro485 is going to be the most authoritive at wake range in consideration of the competing noise levels. Plus, the Pro485 is the most cost-efficient to power when it comes to selecting your amplification versus the more complex 3-Some or Double-Up packages. The only con is you've got to have the width under tower for a pair of these.
The 3-Some basically gives you the same peak output as the Pro485 at wake range but gives up a bit of the linearity at close range. However, there are a couple of tweaks that will smooth it out a bit. This is an all 8-inch package with a narrower mounting span.
The Double-Up is still an HLCD package so it will project to wake range and should give you all that you want in amplitude at surf or at-rest listening. The Wetsounds Double-Up is designed to provide better midbass extension predicated on its large 8-inch dedicated midbass driver, a smoother response and warmer balance for close proximity sound quality listening. It will not have quite the same command at wake range as the above two options.
The Wetsounds 6x9 HLCDs are primarily designed to be retro-fitted into existing pods. A 6x9 has more surface area than a 6.5-inch but less than an 8-inch. Plus, a round speaker is inherently superior to an oval or any other shape. So if I'm starting from scratch I would recommend thinking past the ovals.
For midbass extension and projection power there is no substitute for surface area and that is why I like the Wetsounds Pro485s if you have the tolerance for the size. This is the best overall speaker to be used in a dual role (up close sound quality and long range projection). Also, it is well documented that these contrasting applications are in conflict. Articulate sound at 80 feet can be overly brilliant for the occupants in the boat. A warmer sound quality speaker designed for near field use can sound like it has a wool blanket thrown over it at wake range. An equalizer can be a very effective tool and require little effort to voice your speakers according to the application. While you can tame an HLCD a bit you cannot do the inverse and turn a conventional speaker into something its not without reliability issues to follow.
Since others have chimed in with alternate brands here, let me say that the Exile SXT65 is the best $500 conventional speaker (non-HLCD) I've heard to date. It has the little extra aggression on the highs that you must have in a true tower speaker but is more in balance than many HLCD offerings and therefore is more suitable than most for near-field enjoyment. Plus, this speaker has a continuous and uninterrupted midbass cone for better midbass and lower midrange than its Exile HLCD counterpart. With a conventional tweeter, as good as it sounds up close, much of this energy dissipates before wake range and therefore does not have the same presense as an HLCD. Its a trade-off that could go either way depending on your personal priorities.
Also worth mentioning since other brands have been introduced, is the Bullet HollowPoint 770 HLCD. This speaker is compact (deeper pod with narrow width) and the tightest fit against the tower for extremely low hang height.
As a 770 this is a 7.7-inch driver that has more surface area than a 6.5-inch yet is right on the heels of an 8-inch cone. And greater surface area equates to improved midbass and more lower midrange warmth. Plus, this speaker has a massive compression horn tweeter driver (HLCD) but is tamed a bit for more of a sound quality balance. This speaker is very popular as a single solution for those who want serious longe range projection but is still kinder to the in-boat occupants. And because it is an HLCD it will project, giving you that additional amplitude at 80 feet with safe power handling.
All of the above brands have excellent offerings and each has its place. I hope you can view this as an objective and impartial perspective. Our experience is based on 35 years of audio experience plus we have been highly active in marine since the advent of wake towers. Please reach out if I can answer any questions.

David
Earmark Marine

Brianinpdx
01-08-2011, 05:43 PM
BadBlu -

yes, Your correct...

Yes we make 6x9's but I wouldn't recommend them for your tower. Are you located in the Bay Area by chance? I see you mentioned using a Liquid trends box. Liquid Trends is a retailer of ours and if they are local to you, I'd suggest stopping in to see them. They know tower setups very well. As of last week they had 4 Exile builds happening. Might be a good chance to have a listen.

Also what is your intended budget for this build? This will help organize the setup. The bigger the driver size, the more $$$.

-Brian
Exile Audio

BadbluSi
01-08-2011, 06:17 PM
When I first started looking I had set a 1000 dollar budget for myself, mostly due to only looking at Polk MM or DB series 6x9's. As I've done more research, pretty sure that won't work. Was considering something that had decent mid to low bass but clear highs, don't need a sub for my boat as I'm usually fighting 5 others and a wide variety of music types. I'm actually in WV, so won't get to check them out.

EarmarkMarine
01-08-2011, 06:31 PM
Chris,
If you are prioritizing near field listening with good sound quality then you are very close to your original budget in getting two pair of tower speakers plus a pretty good power amplifier set up. I think you will be pleasantly surprised.

David
Earmark Marine

BadbluSi
01-08-2011, 09:27 PM
Hey David, if I wanted to do 4 tower speakers and an amp on a budget of 1500 what would be my options? And I apologize for all the questions, you've most helpful!!

BadbluSi
01-08-2011, 10:10 PM
Hey Brian or David, has anyone combined a pair of the sxt65 and the XM7's? Guess that would be similar to the double up from WS.

Brianinpdx
01-09-2011, 12:08 AM
Badblu- I generally don't recommend combining the two speakers as they function differently. There are some very advanced tower setups that combined 2 pair sxt with 1 pair xm7. But again this is outside of your budget and requires a lot of advanced install technic.

As it applies to your cost question, 2 pair of SXT tower speakers and powered with the 2ch Harpoon amplifier, puts you right in range of your intended budget. Several guys on this forum run the exact same configuration. They can give you direct feedback. That setup is really nice.

If you need help with Exile gear, you can give us a call at the office --888.249.0970. We can go over tower details, install tips and put you in touch with a dealer in your area for a demo.

-Brian
Exile Audio

EarmarkMarine
01-09-2011, 10:39 AM
Chris,
Its a little tricky to combine the XM7 and SXT65. Here's why. One has a conventional dome tweeter with a 1-inch voice coil. The other has a compression driver with a 2-inch voice coil. The efficiency, and more importantly the thermal power handling capacity are VASTLY different. You would be risking reliability unless you had the ability to tune these together using separate amplifier channels (a 4-chnl. amp) and in this case to protect the speakers you would defeat many of the benefits of the combination. Also, dissimilar speakers do not sum as effectively for maximum output if that were a major concern. As Brian mentioned there are several set-ups that use two pair SXT65s with one pair of XM7s off a single two-channel amplifier. In this scenerio the sound quality attributes of the SXT65s are more dominant and the XM7 compression horn contributes by increasing the projection. A two to one ratio favoring the SXT65 minimizes the potential for a failure. In my opinion, rather than trying to mix and match to find a compromise between contrasting benefits, pick a product that best serves your primary objectives or get a single product that is large enough (a more expensive proposition) that can do both sound quality and power projection.

David
Earmark Marine

BadbluSi
01-09-2011, 11:34 AM
Ok, I think I'm getting the hang of this. So Brian or David, if I really only wanted to have clear sound to about the surfing distance then I don't need to go the HLCD route? And I understand that surface area changes the range of mid bass depending on size. With that being said, if I usually like more mid bass to compliment the DB 651 cabins, should I look at possibly doing 4 7.7 inch speakers? Something like the Bullet 770 or a JL offering? Not that I've decided against Exiles, just looking at the most bang for my buck. Thanks again Brian and David, I had no clue that so much went into choosing a setup

EarmarkMarine
01-09-2011, 12:10 PM
Chris,
Alot of yes and just a bit of no in response to your questions.
Yes, sealed midbass cones, cone surface area and pod displacement definitely correlate to midbass extension and lower midrange warmth. And, yes its true that you do not need an HLCD for surfing range...although HLCDs will vary in their level of treble aggressiveness.
So I could see in your future Exile SXT65s, HollowPoint 770 coaxials or HP HLCDs or perhaps the Wetsounds Double-Up. All under or just over your stated budget including amplification.
However, as a dealer for JL Audio and being extremely familar with their tower product I have to question this one. First, let me say that I am a major JL Audio advocate. Their cockpit speakers are second to none in accuracy. Incredible in fact. And, the tower speakers sound very smooth with GREAT midbass! A single pair of these on the tower will even image which is beyond rare. But, the more linear a speaker is the less sensitive it is and there is no way around this. So this tower speaker, even when optimumly powered, is finished six feet beyond the swim deck, particularly in the treble/articulation department and in the face of exhaust noise. This is a fantastic speaker for an older boat owner with perhaps a sport cruiser or sport yacht but not for most who fit the profile of the typical and younger towboat owner. I could be wrong here but I would scratch this one without a personal audition or without a more detailed explanation. Again, a major JL fan here, just shootin' you straight.

David
Earmark Marine

BadbluSi
01-09-2011, 12:24 PM
Fair enough, I think the bullets will most likely allow me to stay within my budget more so than the others but will do some research on others' experience with the ones you stated. I could always do speakers now and the amp later before the boat comes out of storage due to old man winter!!

you da man
01-09-2011, 12:54 PM
Here's a pic of my Bullet HP 770's on my XLV. You can see that they do have low hang. I'm 6' and still have a couple inches clearance walking under the speakers. For the cabins I went with the Bullet 6.5" speakers. They have alot of mid-bass punch. If you don't have a sub yet in your system, the Bullet 6.5" cabin speakers will make passengers think there's a sub in there somewhere. My system is all powered by JL Audio amps as well.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u197/seeajgo/Boat/2010_0404Gambler0007.jpg

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u197/seeajgo/Boat/2010_0404Gambler0019.jpg

BadbluSi
01-09-2011, 05:16 PM
Hey Da Man, how do you like the Bullet 770's? And how have passengers liked them? Too much too little?

you da man
01-09-2011, 05:34 PM
Hey Da Man, how do you like the Bullet 770's? And how have passengers liked them? Too much too little?

If you have a full boat and are boarding any HLCD speaker is going to be too much for the passengers on the rear seat. I never have more than 5 in my boat so everyone is usually below or in front of the tower speakers. For party coves they rock. The Bullet HP 770 are never too little when adequately powered. The Bullet 6.5 cabin speakers are awesome...love'em.

philwsailz
01-09-2011, 06:53 PM
BadBlu -

HLCD's are aimed at driving sound way back into the wakeboarder at 80ft and beyond. It doesnt matter the brand persay, its a matter of technology. The upside is just that...it gets the sound way back there. The downside is they sound ULTRA crisp for people in the boat and on the swim deck.

-Brian
Exile Audio

I have to chime in. The typcal HLCD tower system sounds ULTRA crisp in large part due to crossover and horn geomotery.

It is possible to have an HLCD tower system that does not exhibit performance characteristics that make it hard to listen to in the nearfield.... Many high-end home systems and recording studio monitor speakers use horns for the high-frequency portion of their driver complement. Done right, a horn can sound good up close, and project to 80 feet and beyond...

Phil
Kicker

EarmarkMarine
01-09-2011, 07:40 PM
Phil didn't give his own Kicker HLCD product a direct plug here but they deserve one. The fact is that most, but not all, HLCD manufacturers run their horn tweeters totally unbridled (crossover) in the SPL race as no one wants to be in second place. The Kicker and the Wetsounds Pro485 are a couple examples of the select few that have a fully developed horn with both the length and final mouth surface area to offer the full bandwidth potential and the gentle but changing flare in order to provide a linear response (in this case 'linear' would describe a smooth speaker that treats the amplitude of all frequencies equally).
Odin, our product manager, was in our marine facility the other day and listened to a number of tower speakers. He has a long music background, is a musician, does mixing for various clubs, is a serious collector of vintage equipment and owns one of the top Focal component sets in his car. From an analytical standpoint, he is highly qualified and has a pretty darn good ear. We have the Kicker HLCDs with the supplemental midbass (6-pack) on display and Odin was really impressed. This was actually his personal favorite.

David
Earmark Marine

BadbluSi
01-09-2011, 08:28 PM
Hey David could those Kicker HLCD's possibly work for my situation?

EarmarkMarine
01-10-2011, 09:19 AM
Chris,
Yes, the Kicker package is a unique combination of a sound quality speaker (Phil needs to post photos of his home satellites that incorporate these drivers) and an HLCD that has the ability to reach 80 feet range without stretching its limitations. Keep in mind that to have comparable output and midbass to a typical four speaker set up you would need six pods for this configuration. That is a minimum of 42-inches across using 7-inch diameter pods plus some required space between each pod.

David
Earmark Marine

philwsailz
01-10-2011, 10:40 AM
The KM6500.2 component system is very flexible. It was designed to accomodate a number of different applications, including 4-can and 6-can setups. The KM6500.2's horn has a two way pad built in to its crossover. You can adjust the horn's loudness by moving a jumper on the crossover. When using the KM6500.2 and the extra KM6500 mids, (what has been dubbed the 6-pack) as David points out at the 42" setup you want the jumper in the "+6" position. This makes the horn louder to match the output of the mids

You can run just the KM6500.2's in 4-can setup like I have on my boat with the jumper set to the "+0" position. I have attached pics of that setup. WIth a single set of horns and mids, the horn's output at "+0" is appropriate and balanced sonically. I have heard of some guys with the KM6500.2 components and the 4-can setup putting the horn's level pad at "+6" for a brighter horn. This provides a lift in the higher frequencies. It is not accurate, but some prefer it. The Km6500.2's by themselves will handle 200 watts RMS. I have 250 going to mine and they don't complain, witht the crossover set appropriately.

Yeah, I have home speakers I just completed using the KM6500.2 component set and the KM6500 mids. It takes 4 channnels of amplification, (I don't know of a 2-ohm stable home amp I can afford) so I am using an Adcom 5-channel home theater amp and biamping the speakers. They are loud, and if you can grasp the description, they sound just effortless, and very open.

Phil
Kicker

Brianinpdx
01-10-2011, 12:26 PM
Phil – I don’t necessarily disagree with what your saying but I also don’t think what I sad was inaccurate either. Sure it is possible to have a tower HLCD system that doesn’t give you the ultra crispness but in the context of the OP’s configuration of using (4) pods, 99% of the offerings on the market would fall into the category that I suggested is “typical”.

A lot of this has to do with how we as manufacturers position our product offerings with design and features.

With that said, I do agree that done right, studio monitors and high-end home systems can implement horn designs when backed up by serious crossover networks which are heavily controlled actively or passively and supplemented with 1/3 octive and beyond equalization. Bottom line those offerings are very expensive, and in very controlled environments’.

Heck, in my 25 years or so now in the 12v world, I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve legitimately been asked why speaker A doesn’t sound as bright as speaker B. And much of the time…. The consumer really thinks that bright is better. I’m sure you’ve seen the same thing. More to David’s point, having 6 pod set up with supplemental mid bass is going to win out every time over a 4 pod setup without supplemental midbass. But it gets costly, and takes up a lot of space. We’ve been doing the same thing in the Exile world with our Hybrid setup (2 pair SXT65 + 1 pair XM7 with the SQ internal xovers option). Sounds absolutely fantastic. As far as I know, Kicker and Exile are the only brands that allow “user adjustable” crossover network changes to help you change the horn.

I don’t mean at all to down play the Kicker HLCD offerings… I think it especially shines for guys that already have empty cans that need re-speakering (is that a word?) It is extremely flexible.. Just thought I’d clarify where I was coming from in my use of the word typical.

Out of curiosity, on your home speakers, are you using the stock crossovers that ship with the tower speakers? Or are you doing something upgraded with custom parts to tailor it to the home environment? Photo’s look nice btw.

-Brian
Exile Audio

philwsailz
01-10-2011, 02:22 PM
Phil – I don’t necessarily disagree with what your saying but I also don’t think what I sad was inaccurate either. Sure it is possible to have a tower HLCD system that doesn’t give you the ultra crispness but in the context of the OP’s configuration of using (4) pods, 99% of the offerings on the market would fall into the category that I suggested is “typical”.



Brian-

The OP mentioned that he wanted someting in the middle ground. 70% of his time is spent in party cove and he doesn't want to kill his passengers, but wants something for when he is tied up with friends. To me that sounds like someone who would value sonic accuracy, while occasionlly looking for efficiency. 4 cans would be ideal for a basic KM6500.2 setup as I have on my boat. For the other 30% of the time, the HLCD design will get the sound back to the rider over the other environmental noises.


With that said, I do agree that done right, studio monitors and high-end home systems can implement horn designs when backed up by serious crossover networks which are heavily controlled actively or passively and supplemented with 1/3 octive and beyond equalization. Bottom line those offerings are very expensive, and in very controlled environments’.



Serious EQ and complicated crossovers are usually the byproduct of poor or inadvertant driver complement selection. When one chooses or designs the right drivers, crossover point, and horn geometry, the whole system can be elegantly simple. Simple is inexpensive. Don't get me wrong, you still want a full high-pass / low-pass passive crossover to keep impedance flat and uniform, and to prevent output overlap between the mid and the horn, but with proper driver selection, a crossover is easy with minimal parts count. More of the magic, (okay not real magic, but it sounds good here :D) in the KM6500.2's is Kicker's use of a Tractrix horn geometry. For all points along the length of the horn, there are no parallel surfaces, and no sections of constant area. The flare is full and mathematically complete; you don't get that in a coaxial design for the size range we are talking. With no parallel walls, and no constant area, the horn has no ringing, and therefore no need for EQ to correct frequency resposne abberations. Another key feature is the midrange. REmoving the horn from the mid allows entire area inside the suspension to make sound; there is no hole in the middle of the mid. Being sealed, there is no opening to the inside of the enclosure allowing pressure and sound to get out.

As for controlled environment, and just for fun, let's all take a moment to realize that as "perfect environments" go, sitting quiet with no motor running in party cove is by acoustic engineering definitions just about as perfect as you can get. In a room you have reflections, standing waves, peaks, cancellations, all from the barriers that affect the sound we hear, (walls, floor and ceiling). The ideal place to measure AND listen to a speaker is outdoors, free of boundaries and surfaces that can color measurement and perception... On a boat, the only real boundary that affects things is the surface of the water....

That was just an aside by the way, I will take my engineer geek hat back off now... :)



Heck, in my 25 years or so now in the 12v world, I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve legitimately been asked why speaker A doesn’t sound as bright as speaker B. And much of the time…. The consumer really thinks that bright is better.

"Brighter is better...." Man I know about that one! As an engineer for a major electronics manufacturer in Chicago back in the day, we had to make sure that the marketing department got their "marketing curve" into the loudspeakers we designed. We engineers used to call it "one-mile-sound" because the speakers were so bright they sounded artifically good. For about a mile. After that the complaints started to roll in, and ears started bleeding. Our ear-brain mechanism willl usually pick something with a perceived louder volume difference as better. That is super easy to do with the upper midrange response region of a loudspeaker, and that is why some speakers just seem to jump off of the demo board and into the shopping cart. It is an illusion though. When you remove the level bias and remove the "one-mile" response bump, the ear-brain mechanism can better focus on quality and accuracy. I always hated putting that high midrange bump in the speakers I designed back then... It wasn't for the sound, it was for sales.


I don’t mean at all to down play the Kicker HLCD offerings… I think it especially shines for guys that already have empty cans that need re-speakering (is that a word?) It is extremely flexible.. Just thought I’d clarify where I was coming from in my use of the word typical.




Downplay? I'll PM ya! :D You are no doubt right. For every boat owner that has a factory coax in a can, I will show you half, (or more) of them that want an upgrade. The KM6500.2 is an easy upgrade for that guy. Let's not forget the DIY guy though... Seems there has been a lot of noise about DIY lately, right? How cool is it that a guy considering adding tower speakers can go choose a can, one that is a color he likes, with a clamp or plate that fits his tower and then put HLCD components in them? That to me is pretty darned cool! Just like a guy can go pick a sub brand he likes, and drive it with an amp brand he likes, while playing tunes from the head unit he likes. I see it as freedom of choice, both for the guy who already has cans, AND the guy who is looking to get some!


Out of curiosity, on your home speakers, are you using the stock crossovers that ship with the tower speakers? Or are you doing something upgraded with custom parts to tailor it to the home environment? Photo’s look nice btw.

-Brian
Exile Audio


All stock baby! The wires go into the back of the enclosures, straight to the stock crossovers... No tweaking necessary. I wonder why one would think it were necessary... Thanks for the photos compliment by the way! When you have a component set that is designed to be sonically flat from the beginning, you don't have to "tweak it" for the particular environment. Indoors, outdoors, with background noise or without, the only difference is how far you crank the volume control.... :D

Phil
Kicker

cham
01-12-2011, 08:49 AM
Wow, lots of information here. I'll admit that while I've spent a majority of my life tinkering in mechanical repairs I've never had any experience in anything audio. I just want some good tunes while I'm wakeboarding :)

My boat is used 80% of the time for boarding and I typically don't have more than 3 passengers. I just bought a quad set of Kicker (KM6500.2) 6.5" HLCD's. I have two open channels on my Sony amp that have 150w each. Should I be fine to hook each can (two in each can) to those channels?

The inside of my boat has 4 Polk db's and a Kenwood 12" sub.

philwsailz
01-12-2011, 09:08 AM
Wow, lots of information here. I'll admit that while I've spent a majority of my life tinkering in mechanical repairs I've never had any experience in anything audio. I just want some good tunes while I'm wakeboarding :)

My boat is used 80% of the time for boarding and I typically don't have more than 3 passengers. I just bought a quad set of Kicker (KM6500.2) 6.5" HLCD's. I have two open channels on my Sony amp that have 150w each. Should I be fine to hook each can (two in each can) to those channels?

The inside of my boat has 4 Polk db's and a Kenwood 12" sub.

Cham-

If your amp will deliver 150 watts RMS into 4-ohms, that will be almost perfect. You can pour more power to the KM6500.2's but 150 will lite them up pretty good. Yeah, you will have a mid can and a horn can for each side. Take a mid and a horn and connnect them to 1 channel of the amp. Then take your other mid and horn and connect them to the other.

Be sure any bass boost is set to off for these two channels, and set your crossover for the two channels to hi-pass. Se the frequency to about 100 and you will be good to go.

Understand the mid is 4-ohms and the horn is 4-ohms, but when you parallel them you do not get 2 ohms like paralleling a pair of coax speakers. The reason is that the crossovers for the horns and mids split up the frequencies, (low and high) so that the mid only "shows" 4-ohms down low, and the horn only "shows" 4-ohms up high.

If your amp only delivers 150 watts max, or 150 watts into two ohms, know that you will probably want to consider a larger amp either now or in the near future. Be looking for an amp that will deliver 150 - 200 watts RMS into 4-ohms per channel. The Kicker ZXM450.2 is one example.

You can go hot-rod like a few guys are contemplating and go up to about 250 watts per channel. I am running 250 watts per side on my boat, and so far all is well. The amp I am using is a Kicker IX500.4, in bridge mode. Yeah guys, I normally recommend against bridging since most full range speakers are lower than 4-ohms, but we designed the KM6500.2's to be EXACTLY 4-ohms, with no impedance dips that would cause amplifier shut-down problems if used with a bridged amp.

Fire it up and let us know!

Phil
Kikcker