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kaneboats
02-01-2012, 10:08 AM
Since we're all bored and I'm about ready to start my stereo mini upgrade I thought I'd throw everything I have out on the table and see if there are some good ideas or something I'm missing. Maybe somebody can benefit from the advice. (BTW, I'm not blowing anybody off the water and this is a truly "budget" system. I have a bunch of kids and surf a lot. My regular river is pretty narrow and has mostly high banks. There are some houses along the shore. The sound funnels back to the rider pretty well. I went with "surf" speakers because I surf more than anything and don't want to be too loud. I don't play the in boat speakers very loud either but want to be able to turn up the tower)

About all I was going to do is pull some new speaker wire (12 gauge) through the tower and add a second pair of Exile SXT65's and the equalizer for better zone control. But I thought maybe it would be good to review the whole thing and see if I should change anything or do any obvious upgrade.

Here's the list of what I have:
stock Kenwookd KDX MP2035 head unit
6 stock in-boat Kicker 6.5
1 stock Kicker ZX200.4
1 Pioneer 10" (I think it's a single voice coil 4 ohm) subwoofer
1 stock Kicker ZX250.2
4 Exile SXT65 tower speakers
1 Exile X600.2 amp
KMA4200 marine audio equalizer

I'm pretty sure this HU has only one set of preamp outs. The plan is to locate the KMA4200 at the helm and run from the preamp outs on the HU to its input then back to the amps for in-boats, tower and subw.

The 200.4 runs the inboats with the rear 4 speakers in parallel.
The 250.2 in bridged mode runs the subwoofer.
The 600.2 would run the 4 tower speakers in parallel.

Anything anybody wants to throw out there for setup, tuning, etc. please do so. Thanks!

sandm
02-01-2012, 10:15 AM
kids=lots of conversation.

best idea is to box it all up and send it to me :)

kaneboats
02-01-2012, 10:20 AM
Stuff's not good enough for a supra.

sandm
02-01-2012, 10:30 AM
never said I was going to use it in my boat did I?? :)

I think it looks like a great system. I would replace the in-boat speakers at some point, as I don't think the factory speakers are kickers best setup, but otherwise, I'd rock it... well thought out for the uses you need and didn't break the bank :)

kaneboats
02-01-2012, 10:59 AM
Thanks.

I guess one question I don't know if I know the answer to is this: You run the in boat speakers on high pass. The subw on low pass. What about the tower speakers? I would think HP as well but not quite sure. I think this is where you have to set the x-over point, right?

KG's Supra24
02-01-2012, 11:04 AM
Yes, towers on high-pass.

bergermaister
02-01-2012, 11:10 AM
I would think HP as well but not quite sure. I think this is where you have to set the xover point, right?

Good question and I've wondered the same. My inboats I think being near the sub sound better on with HP filter. Did a little experimenting on mine and decided that I didn't like the HP filter on the towers. They sounded a little more "warm" without it. After I get my new Krypt EQ installed with the separate volume controls I'll have to play with it again and see what sounds best.

If you ever get the chance, I'd say stand back behind the boat at about surf distance and listen to it both ways. Then maybe listen to it up close - what sounds best to you? As long as you're not blasting it, which doesn't sound like the case, you're probably not going to damage anything being a little more bassy up there.

MLA
02-01-2012, 12:34 PM
I would suggest running the towers on H-Pass and set the X-over on about 100Hz. 80Hz as the absolute floor if they are not being pushed hard. $.02.

kaneboats
02-01-2012, 02:38 PM
That's the kind of stuff I'm talking about. Thanks!

mmandley
02-01-2012, 04:53 PM
Kane for your system i would have to say change amps on the cabins/sub. Get the 700.5 or a amp comparable to that. Just doing that you will increase the sound in the boat by a huge amount. This will also play back to when your surfing because you will hear the sub a bit more while surfing and it will all sound better.

As for the rest looks great for your end goal.

I can say when i did my first stereo upgrade, i took the same two Kickers out and put in the 700.5 and the boat really came alive and rocked really well.

kaneboats
02-01-2012, 05:15 PM
I wonder if that had more to do with the Polks than anything in your early revision. The ZX250.2 in bridged mode indicates 250 watts RMS. The 700.5 shows 210 watts x 1 channel for the sub. To me that's no real difference.

On the other hand, I'm sure the cabins would sound better with the 70 watts x 4 ch. compared to my current 35 watts x 4 ch. with the 200.4

I also have an Infinity Reference 5350a that does about 50w x 4 but only does about 150 watts for the subw. I noticed a big improvement with the sub when I switched it out and the in-boat speakers were about the same. Maybe I should just try to swap the Infinity amp for a better 4 channel one or something.

sandm
02-01-2012, 05:20 PM
not a bad idea. more power at that level would be better. would position yourself when you want to upgrade the cabin speakers as they get more wear on them :)

KG's Supra24
02-01-2012, 05:24 PM
So you are now talking 4 a/b type amps? Even though the amps aren't high power amps, I'd think at some point you are going to run into efficiency issues.

kaneboats
02-01-2012, 05:32 PM
No, just 3. One for each "zone". I don't play the in-boats very loud and adding the subwoofer really helped. Last year I went to a better sub (swapped some off branded thing for a Pioneer one) and swapped out the Infinity amp and went back with the 2 Kicker amps (the 250.2 was running the tower but I got the Exile 600.4 for the tower so I bridged the 250.2 and used it for the subw). The Infinity amp is on a shelf in the garage. It's just "available" but probably headed for the daughter's Mustang now.

KG's Supra24
02-01-2012, 05:44 PM
Ahhh, I gotcha .... I was thinking you were talking about doing 4.

jmvotto
02-02-2012, 01:22 PM
One thing i did after the eq was to add a pac lc1 to split the bow and in cabins, allowing me to turn down the bow when we turn it up without blowing there ears on the little ones.

if you dont turn it up that loud its a non issue

mmandley
02-02-2012, 02:10 PM
Kane, on my first upgrade i kept the factory Kickers speakers, i only upgraded the amps and then added the KMT6s on the tower. The polks were actually added in November when i upgraded the sub to the L7 with a custom box. Then in Nov i hooked up with Exile to upgrade the towers, and by March we gutted the entire thing and went all Exile. So my Polks actually never saw a summer of service, just garage and beer time LOL.

You are correct the 700.5 prolly didnt make a bit of sound difference to the 10 i was running from the factory, but it did realy liven up the cabins.

kaneboats
02-02-2012, 02:12 PM
Good to know-- thanks! I imagine having some more output from the cabins made a big difference at surf distance before you Exiled out the tower. Definitely something to think about.

chawk610
02-03-2012, 08:43 AM
All you guys with AMPS laying aroung gathering dust... have yall not read my signature??? I have cash you know!

kaneboats
02-03-2012, 09:36 AM
Unfortunately, I have someone around here in the amp line ahead of you.

chawk610
02-03-2012, 09:40 AM
I figured.. I read something about a mustang... :(

kaneboats
02-03-2012, 09:44 AM
Does she look like she needs tunes in this thing or what?

13294

mmandley
02-03-2012, 09:47 AM
I think it needs rims personally LOL. I can say thats one pretty lucky girl for her parents to buy her a mustang convertable for her first car.

KG's Supra24
02-03-2012, 09:49 AM
All you guys with AMPS laying aroung gathering dust... have yall not read my signature??? I have cash you know!

What do you need?

I have a 4 channel, a 2 channel, 2 monoblocks

kaneboats
02-03-2012, 10:07 AM
I think it needs rims personally LOL. I can say thats one pretty lucky girl for her parents to buy her a mustang convertable for her first car.

Ha! We had a '96 that I put a new 'vert top on. I upgraded the ugly triangle rims on it to some 2000 GT rims. She put it in a ditch. I bought her a Saturn for $600 which she took care of and drove for a year. She sold it for $1500, then saved from her jobs all summer. I put in the last 1200 or so to help her get this one. Let's say her investment this time around is much more than last time. I wish I would have saved the rims from the totalled one though. I hate the stock '99-2000 ones-- they're asymmetrical to me.

dusty2221
02-03-2012, 10:08 AM
I might have something laying around also. All this talk and I never went out there and looked. My bad. :)

dusty2221
02-03-2012, 10:13 AM
Ha! We had a '96 that I put a new 'vert top on. I upgraded the ugly triangle rims on it to some 2000 GT rims. She put it in a ditch. I bought her a Saturn for $600 which she took care of and drove for a year. She sold it for $1500, then saved from her jobs all summer. I put in the last 1200 or so to help her get this one. Let's say her investment this time around is much more than last time. I wish I would have saved the rims from the totalled one though. I hate the stock '99-2000 ones-- they're asymmetrical to me.

There ya go
http://panamacity.craigslist.org/pts/2788831294.html

kaneboats
02-03-2012, 10:56 AM
She's saving up for some. Dusty, those are not too different from the ones on the old 'stang.

13296

dusty2221
02-03-2012, 11:07 AM
Parking lot must have been full that day?

Only joking assuming everyone involved was ok...

kaneboats
02-03-2012, 11:16 AM
A little damp out- went too fast making a left at the intersection and SLLL IIIII IIIII III PPPPP right into the ditch. It had over 100k on it and some rust underneath even though it looked pretty good. With the straightening it would have required it was a wash. Took the check. Daughter was fine-- only going about 12 mph when it slipped in there. But crunched against the far side a little. Seatbelt on- sore for a day and fine.

chawk610
02-03-2012, 11:21 AM
She looks like a lucky kid! My first car was a '78 VW dasher 4 door. Dang, a first car thread would be a good one!

chawk610
02-03-2012, 11:22 AM
What do you need?

I have a 4 channel, a 2 channel, 2 monoblocks

Well, I reckon a 4 channel would be the deal to run a sub and tower speakers. Let's talk turkey!

Razzman
02-03-2012, 12:46 PM
Hey Kane let me add a couple of things from my experience for you.

Tower speaker wire: When i first added my four SXT65's to the tower I already had 16ga wire there. Being in a hurry and not wanting to mess with it yet I left it and installed them and the Harpoon amp, Brian told me not to worry it would work. Sounded great. Fast forward to last spring, changed amps and such so while i was in there I upgraded to 12ga. Guess what? You could not hear much of a noticeable difference at all if any and even then it was at the higher volume ranges. Just an fyi.

Sub and Kicker 700.5: If you change the sub out to a dual voice coil (DVC) sub you'll get around 400w out of the sub channel and that will make a very noticeable difference in the cabin versus a single voice coil and 200 watts. When i first installed Exile's 12" DVC sub and custom box I used the Kicker ZX700.5 to run it and it sounded good. Another fyi.

kaneboats
02-03-2012, 01:06 PM
Good stuff! I am doing the speaker wire now in case I or another owner ever go to a hybrid setup. I want to hide all the wiring inside the tower and eliminate some connections so I thought I'd go ahead and go to the 12 gauge while I'm in there. If I do change in-boats and subwoofer next year it would most likely be to the Exile stuff to match.

mmandley
02-03-2012, 04:19 PM
Ha! We had a '96 that I put a new 'vert top on. I upgraded the ugly triangle rims on it to some 2000 GT rims. She put it in a ditch. I bought her a Saturn for $600 which she took care of and drove for a year. She sold it for $1500, then saved from her jobs all summer. I put in the last 1200 or so to help her get this one. Let's say her investment this time around is much more than last time. I wish I would have saved the rims from the totalled one though. I hate the stock '99-2000 ones-- they're asymmetrical to me.

Ohh yea i think i do recall hearing about that. Well then thats good if she is saving her own money and spending it on the car i bet it gets taken care for. I know my Neice is 22 now and trashes every car her parents give her. All she can do is whine and pout about her younger sister who is 18 has a bran new car, mom and dad helped her out with the down payment but she makes the insurance and car payments. Its not a fancy car but its new.

KG's Supra24
02-03-2012, 04:46 PM
Well, I reckon a 4 channel would be the deal to run a sub and tower speakers. Let's talk turkey!

I'm not sure where to go from here.

mmandley
02-03-2012, 07:05 PM
I'm not sure where to go from here.

I wouldnt do that off a normal 4 channel but thats just me.

Chawk, bro, sit tight man something will pop up on the classifed area soon enough im sure.

kaneboats
03-02-2012, 11:00 AM
I've been putzing around on my projects and getting a lot of interference with other stuff around the house. Here's some of the progress:

http://www.moomba.com/msgboard/attachment.php?attachmentid=13504&d=1330703991

http://www.moomba.com/msgboard/attachment.php?attachmentid=13505&d=1330703992

mmandley
03-02-2012, 11:04 AM
Noice man :D

bergermaister
03-02-2012, 11:06 AM
What are those green bands under the speaker clamps - inserts?

mmandley
03-02-2012, 11:07 AM
What are those green bands under the speaker clamps - inserts?

Looks like tape to measure and mark placement, but just didnt get taken off before the pics.

kaneboats
03-02-2012, 11:13 AM
Good eye! It was getting dark, man. I had to get about 5 things done while it was in the driveway (like washing the mineral spirits off after removing the decals and cleaning the ski locker. I was in a big hurry. I don't get to pull her out and put the tower up very often b/c my driveway is always crowded.

I did copy Al's no visible wires setup and am very happy with it. I also added a puck light on top of the tower with wires hidden.

jmvotto
03-03-2012, 08:44 AM
Pat looks great, what did you use to mount the eq, just looking for additional ideas.

KG's Supra24
03-03-2012, 10:28 AM
Pat looks great, what did you use to mount the eq, just looking for additional ideas.

They come with some adjustable brackets. I know Dusty mounted his on the same side Kane did and he cut out a metal bracket that he mounted and then mounted the EQ to. It gave him a little more room to find places to screw into under dash.

I put mine on the opposite side and was able to just use the adjustable brackets to get mine to work.

I know if posted this pic numerous times but here is another example. I dont have any from underneath.

http://i1092.photobucket.com/albums/i401/kwgarner24/2011-05-17_19-48-48_77.jpg

kaneboats
03-03-2012, 02:00 PM
I got talked out of that position due to where the key hangs. I used two very small "L" shaped brackets and attached them to the back of the dash by removing existing nuts, putting the brackets on and reinstalling the nuts. Pretty simple really and I had the little L brackets in my "everything else" box. (Note to self-- amend will with instructions to place "everything" box in casket with me.)