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View Full Version : Trailer Woes, Tow Vehicle maybe?



jpetty3023
04-05-2012, 07:02 PM
Went out today and launched/recovered with no problems. I'm back at storage unit and trailer backs up ok until the tires hit the "lip" raised concrete part going into unit. Brakes lock up and it won't go back over the lip. Go fwd a bit and won't back up at all. I unhook trailer adapter and nothing. I unhook trailer from the "family war wagon" and my son and I are able to push the trailer back till it hits lip, not strong enough to get over lip thou so I'm stuck.

Thankfully another boat is coming back to storage unit, Supra owner and a friend of You da Man. I walk over and ask him for some help and like a great SC brother he assists. We hook my trailer to his truck and plug up adapter and it goes in no problems, he doesn't even need to hit gas. He drove fwd about 10 feet, put in reverse and no issues. When it was hooked up to my armada the whole back end of the suv lifted as I was trying to go over lip that's how tight the brakes were engaged.

Just got armada and first time towing with it was Sunday when I first encountered issues with trailer. Added fluid and bleed system and today's launch/recovery at ramp was fine but then the issue at storage unit.

Could the auto level system be throwing off the actuator? Tow hitch to low possibly so auto level is adjusting and throwing it off maybe? I'm gonna flip my hitch over tomo and try to back up with the hitch higher. Ran out of time today cause kids have ball practice

Could it be my tow harness is not wired correctly? I used my adapter on supra's truck and no issues with backing the trailer up so now im thinking at this point it's my tow vehicle and not the trailer brake system.

Fluid in trailer is still full and I did not notice any signs of leaks since vpbleeding system on Monday

you da man
04-05-2012, 07:31 PM
It's your vehicle Jason. No trailer brake issues with Tony's truck or my truck when we hooked up to your trailer. Could be as simple as the tow angle on your hitch because it only happens when you are backing up uphill which has been twice...once into your driveway and twice now into our storage units because of the concrete lip. It does not happen when you are level or backing downhill. Something, whether its the angle or just your vehicle, is not liking backing up the trailer even up slight inclines that it is locking up the trailer brakes. The easy and fast fix is flip the hitch and try this evening or in the morning. Give me a shout.

KSmith
04-05-2012, 08:04 PM
I suspect your tow vehicle wiring. I had mine wired for a fifth wheel trailer and the adapter I was given did not work in reverse up hils, the brakes would engage. I had to leave the existing wiring for the fifth wheel so I added a 5 prong flat for the boat.

Do you have one of those brake lockouts? If not you can tape a couple of nickles together and tape into the slot before you try and back up. There is a slot on the drivers side of the hitch where the hitch slides back and forth during normal towing & braking which engages the brakes. I'll try and find a picture

KG's Supra24
04-05-2012, 08:10 PM
Yep, sounds like the lockout. Are you using a 5 or 4 pin? The trailer is a 5 pin correct?

Does the truck have the 7 pin (round) device in the the back? I would think you just need a 7 to 5 adapter.

KSmith
04-05-2012, 08:10 PM
13767

Couldn't find a pic to I took one

KSmith
04-05-2012, 08:14 PM
Yep, sounds like the lockout. Are you using a 5 or 4 pin? The trailer is a 5 pin correct?

Does the truck have the 7 pin (round) device in the the back? I would think you just need a 7 to 5 adapter.

The 7 round to 5 flat adapter is what I got from Atl Marine, but it didn't work for reverse so I added a flat five and now have both.

jpetty3023
04-05-2012, 08:35 PM
It is the 5 to 7 and I have the adapter. I do have the lock out key but it was in my Moomba folder at home today. Guess where it's at now thou!! I'm glad you posted the pic thou cause I didn't know where it went but now I do.

I have the same adapter that I used with my Tahoe and GMC Sierra but thinking the wiring harness on the Armada may not be wired correct?


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jpetty3023
04-05-2012, 08:36 PM
What's a flat 5 K? The 5 to 7 I'm using now I bought from South Austin Marine and has worked with my last 2 tow rigs


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KSmith
04-05-2012, 08:46 PM
What's a flat 5 K? The 5 to 7 I'm using now I bought from South Austin Marine and has worked with my last 2 tow rigs


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Flat 5 pin connector

13769

jpetty3023
04-05-2012, 09:07 PM
That's what I got, guess I misread or got to much sun or something


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KSmith
04-05-2012, 09:36 PM
http://www.etrailer.com/faq-wiring.aspxThis is a useful diagram.

Boonejeepin
04-05-2012, 09:55 PM
I had a vehicle in the past that had a 7 pin connector but the blue reverse wire was not hooked up.

Be sure the reverse signal is working or the trailer brakes will lock.

kaneboats
04-05-2012, 10:16 PM
I had problems once upon a time in an Isuzu SUV (same truck as Trailblazer and Envoy). Found a blown fuse in the box under the middle row seats. May want to check your fuses.

NCSUmoomba
04-05-2012, 10:24 PM
I had a similar problem when I got my F150. The solution may be similar. My truck came from the factory with the 7 pin round plug. When I backed up, the brakes would not disengage. What I discovered is that the relay energizing the back up circuit to the plug is not installed in the factory. It comes separate and mine was in the center console. I guess they assumed that most people would not ever need or use that circuit. Plugged the relay in the fuse box under the hood, and it works perfectly. I suspect the issue with your Armada is something similar.

b66cf
04-05-2012, 10:29 PM
Back when I only had a 7 round to 4-pin connector, I had to unplug the trailer from the 4-pin and connect a single connection from the light 12V+ pin to the brake lockout solenoid on the trailer when backing in order to disengage the trailer brake (7 round to 5-pin connector is supposed to do this automatically when you shift into reverse).

All you need to do is energize the brake lockout solenoid with 12V+. I have done it before and it works - found the following instructions via a google search:

On the trailer 5 pin flat electrical connector, the blue wire is for the brake lockout solenoid. This should be the blue male pin on the end of the connector. Plug this blue pin into the female pin for the brown wire on the 4 pin flat electrical connector on the tow vehicle. Connected in this manner, forms somewhat of a "T" shape and results in only 1 electrical pin being used on each half of the connectors. Then turn on the lights of the tow vehicle. The brown wire is for the marker/tail lights on the trailer. By turning on the tow vehicle lights, you apply power to the brown wire (of the tow vehicle) which is connect to the blue wire (brake lockout solenoid) on the trailer and energize the trailer brake lockout solenoid. Ground for the circuit is provided through the hitch ball, and the end result is the trailer can then be backed up.

moombacraze
04-05-2012, 10:51 PM
I had a similar problem when I got my F150. The solution may be similar. My truck came from the factory with the 7 pin round plug. When I backed up, the brakes would not disengage. What I discovered is that the relay energizing the back up circuit to the plug is not installed in the factory. It comes separate and mine was in the center console. I guess they assumed that most people would not ever need or use that circuit. Plugged the relay in the fuse box under the hood, and it works perfectly. I suspect the issue with your Armada is something similar.

I found the same thing with my truck. I just had to get the relay put in and everything works perfect now. Get your owners manual out and check that relay.

jpetty3023
04-05-2012, 11:30 PM
I'll check the relay tomo but wouldnt the trailer not go down the ramp fine if that was the issue. I didn't have any issues going down this afternoon.

On a positive note here, the braking ability of the trailer while towing/braking was a lot better today with some fluid running thru the lines:-D

moombacraze
04-05-2012, 11:44 PM
When you are backing down the ramp I don't think you are putting enough pressure to engage the brakes. I could back down the ramp with no problem before I put the relay in my truck.

jpetty3023
04-05-2012, 11:53 PM
Ok cool, I will check all the advice given out tomo. Thanks fellas


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you da man
04-06-2012, 12:28 AM
When you are backing down the ramp I don't think you are putting enough pressure to engage the brakes. I could back down the ramp with no problem before I put the relay in my truck.

Exactly, Jason was only having issues when backing up the trailer up his slightly inclined driveway and our storage unit is a complete concrete facility with our units at a slight incline and an approx 2" concrete lip in enter our units (to prevent water from entering), he was having the brake issue backing up over this lip to the unit. My guess is like you're saying, only when there's sufficent pressure is the brakes engaging backing up.

dusty2221
04-06-2012, 01:27 AM
My ford did this, a fuse was blown. Check the war wagons manual and inspect any fuse that looks like it is related to towing. My issue was identical to yours. I had a fuse panel under the hood, and dash. Took pulling about 5 before I found it.

I was just about to start tracing and testing wires.

jpetty3023
04-06-2012, 09:46 PM
Whose Ghetto
http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f287/jpetty3023/3b640aee.jpg

Checked fuses and didn't find none blown. Read owners manual and it says " blue trailer wire not hooked up from factory, see dealership". Called dealership and my service advisor isn't a boat dude I guess cause he has no idea what I was talking about. Had to et out today so this was the fix once back at my unit. I'll take the boat to the Nissan dealership on Tuesday to have a master tech check it out

wolfeman131
04-07-2012, 12:05 AM
Whose Ghetto

You is, petty! Buy your kid some shoes!

jpetty3023
04-07-2012, 01:16 AM
Bwaahahahaha, damn it boy that's funny.

Boonejeepin
04-07-2012, 05:32 AM
The blue wire is the reverse light wiring that activates the brake release on the trailer when backing up.

It sounds like you needed to tap into the reverse light on the vehicle. Without the blue wire you only have the use of a 4 pin connector and not a 5 pin that you needs.

mmandley
04-07-2012, 12:47 PM
I wouldnt waste your money at the Steelership man. Take it to UHaul and have them look it over if you cant do it yourself.

Doing it yourself isnt that hard. On the 7pin on the truck look under it and there should be a small screw. This will allow you to unbolt it and change the wire locations, add wires, or diconnect wires. Then all you need to do it match it up to the trailer harness.

If you need to know what pin on your 7pin you need to have the back up connected to then post up, all 7pins should be wired by default the same so that any trailer can connect.

2 summers ago my 5pin to 7pin fell off on the highway, it drug and ruined the 5pin adaptor, it was of course the reverse wire. So i had to rewire the trailer to a real 7pin connector in the campground. Got er dun.

jpetty3023
04-07-2012, 01:46 PM
Here's what I got Mike
http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f287/jpetty3023/5b03f33d.jpg
http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f287/jpetty3023/d15f8831.jpg
http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f287/jpetty3023/f2b0cb26.jpg

Boonejeepin
04-07-2012, 03:16 PM
The center pin (round shaped connector) on the tow rig's 7 pin connector should be hot when the tow vehicle is in reverse. Otherwise you will be applying the trailer brakes when backing up (unless you are backing down a grade, like a boat ramp and gravity is pulling the trailer rearward).

Do you have a test light to verify that the center pin is not hot when the tow rig is in reverse? It should be hot when the reverse lights are on (should be able to check with the key off and the transmissions in reverse). Don't forget to set your parking brake.

If not hot you will need to tap into the reverse lights. I don't know your vehicle well enough to know if you need a relay or if you can just tap into the hot wire of the reverse lamps.

Check this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-VYf5MltgI&feature=youtube_gdata_player

jpetty3023
04-07-2012, 03:38 PM
I'll check that out later today. If that's the issue I guess any uhaul shop can do that pretty cheap huh?


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wolfeman131
04-07-2012, 04:14 PM
Petty, give Dusty's Mom a call if ya need direction on how to tap sumthin'.

mmandley
04-07-2012, 04:39 PM
Yea the center pin is the wane you want. This way when you put your truck in reverse is activates the trailer brake bypass.

rsinger
04-07-2012, 05:21 PM
I had the same problem last year. My problem was a bad ground, but I also had other symptoms. Sometimes the trailer lights didn't function properly.

jpetty3023
04-07-2012, 08:33 PM
Trailer lights are all a go, no issues there just the pesky lock up going up hill


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mmandley
04-08-2012, 02:06 PM
Trailer lights are all a go, no issues there just the pesky lock up going up hill


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Well if it makes you feel any better, my truck has no Running lights to the rear plug. I havnt figured out why because its in the body shop for the door damage when i got the front end lifted. When i brought the motorcycle home the sun was going down. We stoped for a coffee and went to leave and i noticed the trailer had no lights.

After some troubleshooting i realized the problem wasnt the trailer, it was my rig. Man i was pissed ive never had a problem with running lights. I ended up pulling one of the license plate lights and taping that wire to light the trailer. What a PITA lol.

It was impressive trouble shooing, i had no wire, or test lights, or meter, i used the crapy wire key ring you get when you buy cars from dealers, i strighten it and used it as a test lead lol

rdlangston13
04-09-2012, 12:59 AM
Had this problem on my girls dads 1500 dodge, however his 2500 was wired correctly and backup the drive way with ease. My truck is also wired correctly 😃

jpetty3023
04-09-2012, 10:56 AM
David did your girls dads dodge ever get working for you or no. If so would you like to share how he fixed it in the 1500

NCSUmoomba
04-09-2012, 04:38 PM
Personally, I would not be screwing around with or tapping into any of the wiring. On a vehicle that new, with a factory 7 round connector, it must be a relay for fuse missing.

Here is a post from a Nissan Forum talking about it:

I recently installed a hitch on my 2006 Armada and ran into this same problem. I installed the standard 3 relays, checked the fuses under the hood and looked for the inline fuses under the dash (never found them) but still could not get it working.

Eventually I discovered a connector for a 4th relay under the dash. It is located right next to the connector for the electric brake controller. I plugged in one of the blue relays (the ones for the left and right trailer lights) and now the running lights work. I talked with the guys at Valley who make the trailer connector kit. They never heard of this 4th relay but said they would send me another relay.

The 06 Armada and newer that did NOT come with tow package will need the 4th relay.

jpetty3023
04-09-2012, 04:44 PM
I agree NCSU. I haven't had a chance to play with it today. Had to take my wife to the airport, she flew out to Colorado for a business trip so I'm stuck with sad kids today. They FI back to school tomo and hope to have the issue resolved by then. Uhaul place after I check a couple more things


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rdlangston13
04-10-2012, 02:06 AM
we never messed with it after that since i dont ever use his truck, my 1500 works just fine but when we put it in reverse in his the reverse lights on the trailer did not light up so to me that means he needs to wire his reverse wire in to activate the solenoid

jpetty3023
04-10-2012, 04:25 PM
Trailer issue fixed. Turned out the center pin had no power when in reverse. Checked it with one of them voltage tester dealios. Traced the fuse and found it was burnt so replaced the fuse and headed to the storage unit. Pulled it in and out 4 times and no issues so I'm good till the fuse blows again!!

Master Tech at the dealership (uhauls closed on Tuesday's) did this work cause I have not even close to the skillsmrequiredmto do this. Didn't charge me anything so I asked him what his drink of choice is. He said miller light so I kindly hand delivered a 12 pack to my new best friend

dusty2221
04-10-2012, 04:31 PM
Weird. Seems like I remember some cool cat making a fuse suggestion!

:)

Glad it's fixed bud.

jpetty3023
04-10-2012, 04:38 PM
Cool cat indeed. Now I'm just hoping I don't have a short in trailer causing the fuse to burn out. Guess better and easier to trace in trailer then in the family war wagon thou if indeed I have a short somewhere. Have you had to change the fuse again dusty or has all been fine since you found it blown

dusty2221
04-10-2012, 05:16 PM
I sold the truck! Solved the issue!

kaneboats
04-10-2012, 05:21 PM
Weird. Seems like I remember some cool cat making a fuse suggestion!

Yup, I believe that was back in post #13.

jpetty3023
04-10-2012, 05:25 PM
lmao, I've been known to do that to but usually inherit some other issue along the way


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jpetty3023
04-10-2012, 05:29 PM
I checked everyone that was marked anything to do with trailer but didn't find it myself, took the mechanic with his fancy tool to locate. I promise I follow all the advice I'm given here!! Advise here is a lot better than Nissan forum. Someone there tried telling me I was confused and my boat had electric brakes!!


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