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stevep33
08-04-2012, 01:57 PM
We keep our 2010 LSV in front of our cottage on Little Traverse Bay off of Lake Michigan on a mooring buoy. When a storm rolls in we get some pretty good size waves and the swim platform has come off ... twice ... and washed up on our beach.

The holes on the bracket have been torn out ... as detailed elsewhere on this forum. I plan to have them TIG welded and re-drill 1/4" holes. Will also replace the original pins with bolts (actually have on one side).

But, I'm concerned that the platform will continue to stress the brackets and also the transom ... even with new material welded-on.

What about drilling several thru-holes in the platform to allow the upward pressure from the water to dissipate as the water will "push-thru" instead of being trapped below the platform?

Teak platforms are made from strips of teak which allows water to pass-thru.

I'm not thinking about Swiss cheese but 6-8 3" holes across the width.

Good idea ... bad idea?

stevep33
08-04-2012, 03:38 PM
Forgot to say that when the swim platform was torn off, the screws into the platform were torn out so I replaced then with 1/4" SS machine screws thru-bolted with lock nuts and SS flat washers.

Also considering putting 2" blocks on top of the brackets to raise the platform higher from the water.

moombahighrider
08-04-2012, 04:25 PM
Stevep33,

I had a lot of shudder in the swim platform from waves. No matter what I did to the brackets, I never could get rid of the movement for the long term until i tried composite door shims. You should be able to find them at any hardware store.

Just use a hammer to drive them down between the platform bracket and the transom brackets. Then break off thr excess shim. They have held up Rock solid all summer, no movement what so ever. It will be a pain to get them out if I remove my platform for winter storage, but it's worth it, IMO.

15649

mmandley
08-04-2012, 04:38 PM
Welcome Steve,

My first thought is why cant you remove the boat from the lake when a storm comes in?

Second i would highly reccomend you DO NOT drill 3inch holes in the swim deck to relieve stress from the waves. The platform is not solid fiberglass, and this will cause it to be soaked on the inside and be damaged.

Also i can only imagine the hurt feet, stubed toes, small feet that would get caught in these holes.
I would go with Moombahighrider's idea first. You also might contact SC about a warrenty on the swim deck if its been damaged from the brackets, you might be surprised and they might fix it all.


Last year <3 year mark> on my boat the swim platform cracked, and was taking on water when boating. They sent me a new platform under warrenty.

stevep33
08-04-2012, 07:12 PM
Stevep33,

I had a lot of shudder in the swim platform from waves. No matter what I did to the brackets, I never could get rid of the movement for the long term until i tried composite door shims. You should be able to find them at any hardware store.

Just use a hammer to drive them down between the platform bracket and the transom brackets. Then break off thr excess shim. They have held up Rock solid all summer, no movement what so ever. It will be a pain to get them out if I remove my platform for winter storage, but it's worth it, IMO.

15649

Great idea ... actually have some in my wood shop here ... I'll try

stevep33
08-04-2012, 07:14 PM
Welcome Steve,

My first thought is why cant you remove the boat from the lake when a storm comes in?

Second i would highly reccomend you DO NOT drill 3inch holes in the swim deck to relieve stress from the waves. The platform is not solid fiberglass, and this will cause it to be soaked on the inside and be damaged.

Also i can only imagine the hurt feet, stubed toes, small feet that would get caught in these holes.
I would go with Moombahighrider's idea first. You also might contact SC about a warrenty on the swim deck if its been damaged from the brackets, you might be surprised and they might fix it all.


Last year <3 year mark> on my boat the swim platform cracked, and was taking on water when boating. They sent me a new platform under warrenty.

I get your drift ... and we have 14 grandchildren between our two owners.

I plan to call SC on Monday.

ian ashton
08-04-2012, 07:44 PM
Welcome! I've never had my boat in the big lake, but we are in TC all the time, and have a family cottage on Torch that we spend a lot of time at.

Do you live in Harbor Springs area?

stevep33
08-04-2012, 08:27 PM
Welcome! I've never had my boat in the big lake, but we are in TC all the time, and have a family cottage on Torch that we spend a lot of time at.

Do you live in Harbor Springs area?

Summers from June 1 'til Haloween. Rest of year in Park City, UT.

ian ashton
08-04-2012, 08:41 PM
Retired?

I want a job that allows that type of flexibility!

stevep33
08-04-2012, 08:50 PM
Retired?

Yes ... but that makes you OLD!!!

mnpracing
08-05-2012, 01:09 PM
I use composite door shims as well to eliminate the dreaded platform rattle. However this won't deal with the issue of the pressure waves put on the platform, it will just transfer it from the brackets attached to the platform (in the form of wearing through the 1/4" holes) to the brackets on the transom which is a much bigger fix. I just hope that Moomba through-bolted the transom brackets with a nice thick metal plate backing....

stevep33
08-05-2012, 05:09 PM
I use composite door shims as well to eliminate the dreaded platform rattle. However this won't deal with the issue of the pressure waves put on the platform, it will just transfer it from the brackets attached to the platform (in the form of wearing through the 1/4" holes) to the brackets on the transom which is a much bigger fix. I just hope that Moomba through-bolted the transom brackets with a nice thick metal plate backing....

Think I'll look at that tomorrow.

stevep33
08-08-2012, 09:08 AM
The brackets are at the local welder being TIG welded and re-drilled. That will solve one problem.

SC suggested that if I drill holes, that I should gel coat them to keep water from getting absorbed into the composite core.

I'm still concerned about the upward pressure of water in rougher seas and boat wakes. Looking for aluminum flanges to insert onto drilled holes.

trevormcfar
08-08-2012, 02:03 PM
For what its worth...

Our swim platform almost came completely off a couple of weeks ago when a friend noticed the swim deck was extremely loose while surfing. Upon inspection, we noticed the one side was completely off the bracket as all the screws had stripped out. We took the swim platform to the local marine dealer and he said it happens more often than some may realize.

He said the platforms were really designed for people to stand on... Yes, water will bounce the platform up and down, but the water pressure while operating in high waves, or surfing can be extreme. Over time, the screws may pop and strip out. The other obvious reason for a platform to come off is if it was hit by another boat in a marina when we were not around? Since there was no evidence of this, I was pretty sure it was water as we do operate on a large lake and surf all the time.

Anyways, the fix was simple and very effective (thus far). He filled the holes with appoxy since they were stripped and let it cure. He then drilled 3 more holes in each bracket since there was only 6 screws holding each bracket onto the platform. He used one size larger screws for added strength and prior to re-assemby, they coated the bracket and the swim platform with PL4100 or something similar. Once screwed down and the PL cured, there is no way that bracket will come off unless the entire fiberglass rips off with it.

The concern of water getting into the additional screw holes should be solved by using the PL product. If your not happy with the PL oozing past the brackets... just take a knife and run it down the bracket once its cured and your done.

FYI, upon inspection, it seems the foam does not provide much "grab" for the screws and the only thing really holding the bracket onto the platform is the small amount of fiberglass over the foam. Take a look at the holes and you will see there is not much there! No wonder the screws rip out over time!

Anyways, that fixed our problem and the platform is very secure on the brackets.... It still bounces as this is a seperate issue with the bracket on the boat, however we have never worried about this.

Hope it helps.

stevep33
08-08-2012, 03:52 PM
Trevor,(name of one of my grandkids) Thanks for your detailed reply and PM.

My screws attaching the bracket to the platform also ripped out and I, as did you, discovered there was not much fiberglass in the thickness...mostly core composite. My solution was to drill the holes all the way thru and use 1/4" SS machine screws with a SS washer on the top and a lock nut below. That seems very secure.

I had not considered the seeping of water into those holes. Think it is fixable as I will pull the boat out in about three weeks 'til next June. That will give the composite 9 months to dry-out in our low humidity, heated basement. Then I will put some gel-coat in the holes to tighten the seal.

What is PL 4100? Google couldn't find it.

However, I will still have the rattle (flexing) in the platform and the movement was enough that the thru-holes on one bracket wore completely thru (and the platform was lifted OUT of the receiver causing the screws on the opposite bracket to be torn away) and the other was very oblong. Those are being welded as I type. I plan to insert composite door shims to minimize the flexing.

The loose nature of the brackets helps to take some of the strain off the assembly similar to the flexing of an airplane wing. If I use the shims, it will transfer all the strain to the transom of the boat.

I'm seriously thinking of drilling about (10) 3" holes thru the platform and coating the inside of the hole with gelcoat. That should:

1: allow the upward pressing water to escape thus lessening the strain as is the case with teak swim platforms which are about 40% open.
2: the gel-coat will seal off the water from entering and soaking the composite.

I plan to start with 5 holes to see what the effect will be.

I also plan to put the boat on the mooring without the platform 'til the grandkids arrive and remove it once they leave. We don't need the platform for general runnung around or cocktail cruises.

Again, thanks for your input ... and all the others who contributed.

cab13367
08-08-2012, 06:33 PM
I'm seriously thinking of drilling about (10) 3" holes thru the platform and coating the inside of the hole with gelcoat.

I just think this is a horrible mistake. People are going to break their toes stepping in those holes. Please consider buying a teak platform or have one made that has space between the slats but is not a safety issue.

FWIW, I've not had any issues with mine. I do have a little play which I get rid of by sticking a cut or lock washer in the gap between the bracket on the boat and the bracket on the platform. I can't use shims since I have to remove my platform after each use and it's easy to remove the washer using needle nose pliers. I have some pics of it somewhere on here. I will find it and repost to this thread.

cab13367
08-08-2012, 06:42 PM
Here they are. Simple but in my case, effective. Been doing this a couple years now and still working great.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/d43277f8.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/3460176b.jpg

stevep33
08-08-2012, 07:13 PM
I just think this is a horrible mistake. People are going to break their toes stepping in those holes. Please consider buying a teak platform or have one made that has space between the slats but is not a safety issue.

FWIW, I've not had any issues with mine. I do have a little play which I get rid of by sticking a cut or lock washer in the gap between the bracket on the boat and the bracket on the platform. I can't use shims since I have to remove my platform after each use and it's easy to remove the washer using needle nose pliers. I have some pics of it somewhere on here. I will find it and repost to this thread.

Al, thanks for your input. That lock-washer looks like a good option ... and easy to get out.

Another option ... how 'bout I use my router and rout some "slots" in the platform ... say 3/4" like you get with a teak platform? then I gel-coat the exposed center. Shouldn't get stubbed toes with that.

beat taco
08-08-2012, 07:59 PM
Do you guys have Allen head pinch bolts at the top of your brackets?

stevep33
08-08-2012, 08:41 PM
Do you guys have Allen head pinch bolts at the top of your brackets?

No. But, that set my (alleged) mind spinning. could drill and tap an allen head screw in the top to stop the movement.

Hmmmmmmm????

cab13367
08-08-2012, 08:42 PM
Al, thanks for your input. That lock-washer looks like a good option ... and easy to get out.

Another option ... how 'bout I use my router and rout some "slots" in the platform ... say 3/4" like you get with a teak platform? then I gel-coat the exposed center. Shouldn't get stubbed toes with that.

I think that's a better option than the swiss cheese one :)

How about just removing the platform and putting it in the boat when the boat is moored? I know it's a bit of a pain but most of us have a longer list of things to do before and after boating.


Do you guys have Allen head pinch bolts at the top of your brackets?

Mine does not. Some guys have added it, worked out for some, not so much for others.

beat taco
08-08-2012, 09:05 PM
15721

Here's mine

stevep33
08-08-2012, 09:07 PM
How about just removing the platform and putting it in the boat when the boat is moored? I know it's a bit of a pain but most of us have a longer list of things to do before and after boating.

Our boat gets daily use for about 6 weeks. We divide the day up into 2 hour segments for the various families. Only about 40-50 hours per year.

Now I'm thinking that we may leave the platform off 'til the grandkids arrive, leave it on for the six weeks then take it off when they leave. With the set-screw/shim, how much wear can it get in six weeks?

stevep33
08-08-2012, 09:11 PM
15721

Here's mine

Looks like a good option. Thanks.

eblom
08-08-2012, 09:40 PM
Have you thought about getting a hoist?

stevep33
08-08-2012, 10:01 PM
Have you thought about getting a hoist?

Actually have one we used for our Boston Whaler.

But

Lake Michigan is down two to three feet from historical levels and we can no longer get the Whaler ... much less the Moomba on a lift as we have only 12 inches of water at the end of our dock. And, we would need to extend the dock about 50 feet to approach deeper water.

Lift sits on dry land now waiting for a change. (storage)

Was not too long ago (1986) we had to add large rocks in front of the cottage to keep the water from washing over Beach Drive. It'll come back ... historical highs and lows are in excess of 6 feet.

wolfeman131
08-09-2012, 02:55 PM
Search posts from Ian Ashton. He tapped out the brackets from the underside and installed set screws to get rid of the slop. This design was integrated into the 2012 brackets.

trevormcfar
08-09-2012, 09:22 PM
http://www.buy.com/prod/osi-sealants-10-oz-grey-pl-premium-advanced-polyurethane-construction/227415572.html

Not sure if this is the exact glue they used, but this is the type of product I was referring to. Since you already drilled through your swim platform you are now past the point of no return... I would suggest the following:

1) Once you get the bracket secured on the swim platform, you will have brackets on top of the swimdeck if I understand what you are doing. To help finnish the end result, you may want to consider buying a sea deck platform and recover the entire platform. You could cut out the outline of the brackets if needed, which may actually look ok with an end result of having a flush swim deck once again... Not sure, but it may be worth looking into.

2) If you are really worried about the water pushing up, consider something like this....
http://www.swim-platform.com/vents.html

This will eliminate the added pressures of the water going up, plus if done right it would look pretty cool (expecially if you get the lights)... Extreme, but may be better and cheaper than buying a whole new deck if your repairs do not actually work.

The washer trick looks good to stop the slop but to be honest, Im not sure that would solve the pressures of the water pushing up on the swim deck... How much transfer of the pressure to the boat brackets is debatable, and to me, not really worth doing, other than to eliminate the clunking sound... Personal preference I think, but Im just a crazy canuck eh!

Good luck... Maybe post some pics if you can... I am interested in your final product as I may have to rethink our fix down the road too...

stevep33
08-09-2012, 09:51 PM
Search posts from Ian Ashton. He tapped out the brackets from the underside and installed set screws to get rid of the slop. This design was integrated into the 2012 brackets.

Found it. Looks good and I would get that design if I have to replace the current brackets.

stevep33
08-09-2012, 10:06 PM
Trevor, thanks for the suggestions. Those vents look really nice.

I got the brackets back today all TIG welded with nice new holes drilled.

Plan to re-attach the platform tomorrow. Will use the washer trick to stop the play.

Last of the grandkids go home next Wednesday. After that, I won't need the platform so I'll take it off.

When I pull the boat right after Labor Day, Will look at the inside (engine compartment) to see how the "other" end looks. If necessary, will fabricate backing plates to spread the strain.

Then, next year will only add the platform when the kids arrive and pull six weeks later when they leave. Last year the platform was on for three months in the lake and that is what lead to the first failure.

wolfeman131
08-10-2012, 12:40 PM
Found it. Looks good and I would get that design if I have to replace the current brackets.

You can install on your current brackets or try the split washers/vents. Good luck.