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mimoomba
09-03-2012, 10:52 AM
Ok. I have a 2002 Outback LS carb engine. Last week boat started to die out on water. Kept acting like I was out of gas. Finally got it on the trailer, aand brought it home. Changed the fuel filter and just triued to take it back out. Cranks but no fire. Oil pressure is showing on the gauge when I crank. I am thinking bad fuel pump, but not sure how to test it.

mimoomba
09-03-2012, 11:11 AM
I just ran jumper wires directly from battery to pump. and hummed for a few seconds then gurgled and quit. Now it doesn't do anything when I jump it.
Frustrating...

lewisb13
09-03-2012, 11:55 AM
Does the boat get taken out very regularly?

mimoomba
09-03-2012, 12:01 PM
yes, every weekend.
I just jumped across the 2 wires at the oil pressure sensor and still no start.
I dumped a little gas down card and get it run for a second. Really thinking my fuel pump is shot. Trying to find one right now.
What were you thinking?

lewisb13
09-03-2012, 12:05 PM
Either the fuel pump or filter but the pilot jets get clogged in motors so easy these days. If you put it in neutral and give it half throttle will it start? That'll tell you right away what the problem is.

mimoomba
09-03-2012, 12:07 PM
changed the filter already. I just checked for power at pump. When I crank it I get power, and if I jump the pressure switch I get power. Really thinking it is a bad pump. Now to find one today

DOCDRS
09-03-2012, 12:55 PM
You could try and unhook the line from your pump to your carb and see if it will pump any gas to confirm the bad pump

mimoomba
09-03-2012, 03:54 PM
Turned out fuel pump was the problem. Oreilley's ordered me one, got it in by 2:30. And put it on. Boat is on the water! Just hope this isn't the last day on the water for the year. Thanks for the help guys.

Bend
09-05-2012, 01:52 PM
I have the same problem as boat won't stay cranked. i have read this post and others so i will start in the middle. Please tell me if this is possible....



The fuel pump does not cycle when the iginition is turned on.

I have fire but it won't stay cranked when I release the key switch. (I don't have consistent fire.....fires/turns over sometimes....sometimes not)
If I put the volt meter on the fuel pump I get a reading only when the switch is engaged and only when the engines fires.
I don't get a reading if the engines does not fire.
When I disconnect the fuel pump I get a reading on the volt meter every time I turn the ignition switch.

Anyone else have this problem? Does this lead to a solution? Or, am I imagining things?

Where do I find the ECM and the reset circuit switch box? [2001 Moomba Outback LS]

kaneboats
09-05-2012, 02:49 PM
Just hope this isn't the last day on the water for the year.

Don't say that!!!!!!!!!!

kaneboats
09-05-2012, 02:51 PM
I have the same problem as boat won't stay cranked. i have read this post and others so i will start in the middle. Please tell me if this is possible....



The fuel pump does not cycle when the iginition is turned on.

I have fire but it won't stay cranked when I release the key switch. (I don't have consistent fire.....fires/turns over sometimes....sometimes not)
If I put the volt meter on the fuel pump I get a reading only when the switch is engaged and only when the engines fires.
I don't get a reading if the engines does not fire.
When I disconnect the fuel pump I get a reading on the volt meter every time I turn the ignition switch.

Anyone else have this problem? Does this lead to a solution? Or, am I imagining things?

Where do I find the ECM and the reset circuit switch box? [2001 Moomba Outback LS]


I think on your model there's a big red button on the back of the engine. You almost have to stick your head under the clam shell to see it. That's where it was on my 2000. Usually everything will be dead though if you need to reset that one. In later models it's behind the observer's seat on the wall.

Bend
09-05-2012, 04:01 PM
OK, so that's the ECM? The 50 amp thing? Yes, I do have power to blower, radio, etc, so that is not my problem, right? i also put the volt meter to it and get 11.5 volts on it and the thing next to it.

I have also replaced the ignition. It originally had a Quicksilver keyless iginition but I think it was ruined by water.

Does the power to the fuel pump make any sense to you?

kaneboats
09-05-2012, 04:39 PM
Where's Malo? He's the troubleshooter.

james yarosz
09-06-2012, 09:33 AM
Hey Doug,for future reference what did O,reilys get a fuel pump for? I have an 03 carbed LS.I haven't had any issues but I like to be prepared.

Bend
03-15-2013, 09:32 AM
I did not solve my problem last fall so I'm back at it this weekend and hope to have some help from this forum. To add to my previous post I connected the fuel pump directly to the battery and it is working so it isn't the fuel pump.

When i replaced the ignition I used:
Yellow/Red - Start
Purple - Ignition
red - Battery

Is this correct?

Has anyone had to replace the circuit board on their Moomba?

Thanks.

rdlangston13
03-15-2013, 10:28 AM
Air fuel and spark...start with spark, then verify fuel with a fuel pressure gauge or test light, then check compression. If you have all three it should run


Sent from my iPhone

parrothd
03-15-2013, 10:52 AM
Did you check the oil pressure sensor?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Bend
03-15-2013, 11:08 AM
Did you check the oil pressure sensor?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Sensor, not gauge, correct? Located on engine?

Going up to lake this weekend. Will try this.

Thanks.

z28ke
03-17-2013, 09:14 PM
For basic diagnostic: If its a Holley carb start by taking off the flame arrestor on top of the carb. Have someone pump the throttle while you look down the carb, paying attention to the front two barrels. When the throttle is pumped you should see a stream of fuel come from the squirter, which is located between the two front barrels towards the front of the barrels with a Phillips head screw on top. The stream of fuel will hit the venturi, the little round thing in the middle of each barrel. For the sake of basic diagnostics if it squirts you have fuel.

Next check your spark. Remove a spark plug, put the wire back on it and hold the head of the plug against the block or anything else metal. Keep your fingers on the plug boot so you don't get a zap from the coil, and have someone try to start the engine. You should see the plug sparking as the engine turns over.

Try this and report back!

Bend
03-18-2013, 09:23 AM
[Can't see where this was posted. Apologies if re-posted]

Thanks to all for the suggestions!

Back from the lake. Problem remains. I don't have access to the internet at the lake so it continues to be a back-and-forth thing.

Some of this is repeating but this is what I have:
1) Ignition in the start position - engine fires and RUNS.
2) When I release the switch (to the ON position the engine dies. I may be wrong but this tells me my problem is totally electrical.
3) Multi-Meter in the ON position shows 12 volts so my wiring of the NEW standard keyed ignition is correct (yellow/red, purple, red wires)
4) With the ignition in ON position: no reading on gauges, blower runs, depth finder shows power and readings. Bilge pump doesn't work but I have 12 volts reading on the multi-meter so I assume the bilge pump is dead.
5) When I unplug the wiring plug under the dash that says "to the guages" and plug back I hear the sound of the gauges 're-setting' but don't see any reading when looking back at the gauges.

Boat was bought used with keyless ignition installed. Atlanta Marine says they did not install the keyless ignition. I was having some problems starting the boat before the keyless ignition went bad. I would have to unplug the wiring harness in the back of the engine to reset the gauges and start the engine.

I have a picture of some wiring in the rear of the engine that doesn't look like factory wiring that I would like to share with anyone willing to help. It is a red wire that has been cut and spliced with two yellow/black wires. One striped wire goes to the other red wire and the other goes to a purple wire. I am not at the boat and I can't remember if I saw a disconnected/cut purple wire.

I hopes this helps.

Thanks again.

wolfeman131
03-18-2013, 10:30 AM
did you buy the boat from Atlanta Marine?

season here is about to start - you need the boat to start!

this might be one that you need a pro to address, IMO.

beat taco
03-18-2013, 10:52 AM
Just so I got this straight, the boat runs fine if you keep pushing the start button? Do you have any pics of the wiring that is spliced at the back and the back of the push button?

I would be looking to undo all the shotty work and fix any wiring that was cut into with solder and heat shrink tubing. I would also be removing the push button and trying a temp key or hot wire to eliminate it as the problem.

maxpower220
03-18-2013, 10:58 AM
Based on what you just posted, replace the ignition with a standard key ignition.

Bend
03-18-2013, 11:08 AM
did you buy the boat from Atlanta Marine?

season here is about to start - you need the boat to start!

this might be one that you need a pro to address, IMO.

Bought from the person who purchased it at Atlanta Marine. I'm on Oconee. My problem is my trailer needs work and I don't have a vehicle to pull it with anyway.

Bend
03-18-2013, 11:09 AM
Already installed a standard key ignition and confirmed the wiring is correct.

Thanks.

wolfeman131
03-18-2013, 11:09 AM
Based on what you just posted, replace the ignition with a standard key ignition.

I'm pretty sure that's what he has done, but something is goofed up in the wiring from where the prior owner put in the push button start. Who knows what that person did either under the helm or back at the engine?

You might be able to track down the prior owner and get some idea of what they did. Otherwise, I think you're going to need to rip it all out as Jake stated. It's something I might not take on so that's why I suggested taking it to ATL Marine.

Bend
03-18-2013, 11:12 AM
Just so I got this straight, the boat runs fine if you keep pushing the start button? Do you have any pics of the wiring that is spliced at the back and the back of the push button?

I would be looking to undo all the shotty work and fix any wiring that was cut into with solder and heat shrink tubing. I would also be removing the push button and trying a temp key or hot wire to eliminate it as the problem.

I installed a standard key ignition and confirmed the wiring is correct. If I turn it all the way to start the engine fires and starts but i can't hold it in START long because I will ruin the starter.

I will try to send you the picture.

Thanks.

Bend
03-18-2013, 11:23 AM
17028
Hope this works.

jmb
03-18-2013, 01:18 PM
My last boat did that. I found that during the start function, voltage went through a resistive wire. When the boat started and you went to the on position the voltage went from the resistive wire to another wire that was fused under the dash. These wires were feeding the coil. My coil was shorted. Got a new coil and replaced the fuse and all was fine. I have no idea if this will help you or not. This was on a 1985 Mercruiser inboard/outboard.

Bend
03-18-2013, 03:06 PM
I installed a standard key ignition and confirmed the wiring is correct. If I turn it all the way to start the engine fires and starts but i can't hold it in START long because I will ruin the starter.

I will try to send you the picture.

Thanks.

Picture attached. Thanks
17029

parrothd
03-18-2013, 03:19 PM
Just so I got this straight, the boat runs fine if you keep pushing the start button? Do you have any pics of the wiring that is spliced at the back and the back of the push button?

I would be looking to undo all the shotty work and fix any wiring that was cut into with solder and heat shrink tubing. I would also be removing the push button and trying a temp key or hot wire to eliminate it as the problem.


I'd check the oil pressure switch, generally the boat will run while you have the starter engaged, and stops when you release the key, the switch cuts power to the fuel pump...

http://www.moomba.com/msgboard/showthread.php?4421-UPDATE-Carb-Fuel-Issues-Boat-Runs!&p=25930#post25930

I'd bypass pass it to eliminate it, probably explains why the issue was intermittent. You should get the manual and verify the wiring...

Bend
03-18-2013, 03:51 PM
I'd check the oil pressure switch, generally the boat will run while you have the starter engaged, and stops when you release the key, the switch cuts power to the fuel pump...

http://www.moomba.com/msgboard/showthread.php?4421-UPDATE-Carb-Fuel-Issues-Boat-Runs!&p=25930#post25930

I'd bypass pass it to eliminate it, probably explains why the issue was intermittent. You should get the manual and verify the wiring...

This sounds promising. It didn't know what to look for while I was at the lake this weekend. Makes sense.....I forgot to mention that I don't get the 12 volts to the fuel pump when the key is in the ON position.

I'm a couple of hours away but wish i could go right now and try this.

Fogot to say a BIG...........
THANK YOU!

parrothd
03-19-2013, 11:52 AM
Wiring diagram for LSV/Kamerbra probably the same for all early models.

http://www.parrothd.com/moomba/2002-moomba%20wiring.pdf

Bend
05-14-2013, 03:19 PM
parrothd,

Finally got back to the lake.

replaced the oil sensing unit. Still no luck. Everything remains the same. I get fire from the engine in start mode but engine dies when in "on" mode on ignition.

Checked wiring as best as I could.

Could I have replaced with the wrong ignition switch? (The fuel pump does not cycle in the "on" position but has power in the "start" position.

maxpower220
05-15-2013, 07:55 AM
If this helps you, my fuel pump cycles on when I move the keyed ignition from OFF to ON.

Perhaps it would be helpful if you posted a picture of the wiring on the back of the motor that you stated was spliced. The wires that you stated were spliced, where do they go? Can you tell why they were spliced?

You may want to get the dealer to print off a wiring diagram of your boat.

DOCDRS
05-15-2013, 10:15 AM
Maybe the new ignition switch is bad

Bend
05-15-2013, 02:06 PM
Check page three. The picture is near the bottom of the page. Thanks

Bend
05-15-2013, 02:09 PM
If this helps you, my fuel pump cycles on when I move the keyed ignition from OFF to ON.

Perhaps it would be helpful if you posted a picture of the wiring on the back of the motor that you stated was spliced. The wires that you stated were spliced, where do they go? Can you tell why they were spliced?

You may want to get the dealer to print off a wiring diagram of your boat.

Check page three. The picture is near the bottom on the page. I don't know why they were spliced but I [too] thought it must be something to do with the keyless igintion cause i know it didn't come from the factory liked that. i have the wiring diagram.

z28ke
05-16-2013, 09:42 PM
If the pump doesn't prime when you turn the key from off to on (not all the way over to hit the starter) then your problem is in the wiring. It should prime for a couple seconds then stop until you start it, then it stays on. This would explain why it shuts off when start is released, 12v to the fuel pump is being cut too. Somewhere down the line power to the fuel pump and likely the ignition are wired incorrectly.

z28ke
05-16-2013, 09:46 PM
Should be somewhat straightforward to trace down with a multimeter and wiring diagram.

Bend
05-17-2013, 10:22 AM
Folks, I may have just found sometnhing but I won't know until I get back to the lake.

I have reviewed my notes on my wiring of the new ignition and the wiring diagram. I have a red wire (battery) on the ignition. The wiring diagram calls for a red/violet wire!!!!! Stupid me!

Thanks for all the help. I'll let you know the outcome.

Bend
05-17-2013, 01:20 PM
Hold on. I lost my confidence.

Back to the diagram. The ingition circuit breaker has two wires 1) Red and 2) Red/Violet. Since I ran the Red wire directly to the ignition switch....didn't just bypass the circuit breaker? The red/violet wire is only seen here and nowhere else on the diagram.

wolfeman131
05-17-2013, 01:27 PM
I don't have an answer to your issue, just some food for thought:

There is a certain amount of pride one can take away from doing a job themselves. There is also a point in time where you have wasted too much of your time, energy and effort on something that you could/should have paid an expert to do. The tipping point is sometimes referred to as the point of diminishing returns. I often go too far on the wrong side.

maxpower220
05-17-2013, 02:34 PM
It makes that most sense that something is wired wrong. Taking all of the factors into account, I would used the diagram and trace every wire. Start with the "spliced" ones or the ones know to have been moved, removed, or altered in the process of the new/old ignition.

Drew has a great point as the weather is getting good, lot of daylight. It's fine to waste time in the winter, now you can use the boat, don't waste the weather.

Bend
05-25-2013, 12:56 PM
There are three wires at the back of the engine: orange, red, and purple. Orange has 12.3 volts in the on position only. The purple and red don't show any voltage at anytime. I straight wired the fuel pump with a switch and the boat will crank and run. I think the purple one should have voltage with the key in the on position then giving power to the red wire and fuel pump. Any suggestions or ideas?

parrothd
05-25-2013, 02:00 PM
You did check the oil pressure switch right?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Bend
05-27-2013, 10:38 AM
There are three wires at the back of the engine: orange, red, and purple. Orange has 12.3 volts in the START/RUN position only. The purple and red don't show any voltage at anytime. I straight wired the fuel pump with a switch and the boat will crank and run. I think the purple one should have voltage with the key in the on position then giving power to the red wire and fuel pump. Any suggestions or ideas?


Correction: Orange has 12.3 when ignition is in the START/RUN position.

Bend
05-27-2013, 10:42 AM
[back from the lake-still no luck]

Brought alternator home. Tested good.

Bend
05-27-2013, 04:26 PM
Not sure how to check the oil pressure switch. I did figure out that the wiring in the back of the engine was to bypass the oil pressure switch. Should I purchase a new one ($40)?? I should get 12.3 volts on the violet wire, shouldn't I? The red wire goes to the fuel pump so it should get its power from the purple when the ignition is turned to "on".

Again, I have confirmed that my wiring of the ignition switch is correct by the wiring diagram and the volt meter ....touching the red and the violet I get 12.3 volts in the "on" position. Nothing when in the "off" position. I mentioned earlier that the wiring diagram said "red/yellow" but I have "red" which I believe just bypasses the circuit breaker (The red has a constant 12.3v when connecting the volt meter and using a ground. Does that sound right?

Also mentioned before......if I have power for the violet wire at the switch but the gauges do not cycle or work, does that mean I have a disconnect in between? Could it be that the circuit board has gone bad?

parrothd
05-27-2013, 04:38 PM
I thought you said you replaced or tested it v already!?!? That should've been the first step.... You can get the same part at Napa for $9.. Search the forum... The one wire should only get power when there's oil pressure when the engine is running..

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Bend
05-28-2013, 08:09 AM
17364

I replaced the Oil Sensing (sending??) unit. I didn't know what the oil pressure switch was until you told me. The wires at the switch had been spliced together to bypass the switch ever since I bought the boat and has been running like that for eleven years.

I looked for one just like the one on the boat (pic attached). I didn't see one like it on the Napa site but I guess it doesn't have to look the same (???). I should just change the wire connectors to fit over the one post??

In another post R98ROO said something about a violet wire running to a kill switch. Do you know what and where that is?

parrothd
05-28-2013, 12:29 PM
17364

I replaced the Oil Sensing (sending??) unit. I didn't know what the oil pressure switch was until you told me. The wires at the switch had been spliced together to bypass the switch ever since I bought the boat and has been running like that for eleven years.

I looked for one just like the one on the boat (pic attached). I didn't see one like it on the Napa site but I guess it doesn't have to look the same (???). I should just change the wire connectors to fit over the one post??

In another post R98ROO said something about a violet wire running to a kill switch. Do you know what and where that is?

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=MPEOP6632SB_0365579324

Not sure why you have a 3 prong one, maybe someone swapped it out? I don't have a kill switch/lanyard on my 02...You should get the wiring diagram from skier choice....

Bend
05-28-2013, 02:50 PM
It looks original to me. The engine paint chipped off when a removed it.

I've got the wiring diagram and I thought the same thing......I don't see a kill switch anywhere. I do see "warning Sensor" and a "Warning Light" on the diagram. They are somewhere in the back of the engine near the 8 point wiring harness plug. The Warning Sensor (Violet-A and Blue wires) connects to something with #10 Rings but I don't know what the warning sensor is.

parrothd
05-28-2013, 03:13 PM
If you've looking at the diagrams I posted I believe that's the walter v-drive light sensor...I look at the diagrams today and they're missing the fuel pump circuit which is what you need.

Bend
06-03-2013, 09:33 AM
Well, well......not too proud to admit my mistakes. Got to lake Friday. Had rehearsed my plan of action to trace the wiring with the volt meter and wiring diagram as many of you had suggested several times. Got under the dash as I have a hundred times before. Looked to trace the violet/purple wire from the ignition switch to the circuit board. Well, I be damned if the post on the circuit board had no purple wire!!!!!!!!!! Cut the purple wire from the ignition switch, touched it to the post, turned the key..............boooooom. Boat cranked and ran beautifully!!!!!!!!! Got to ski the entire weekend.
Only problem now is the gauges. replace MDC controller?????

Thanks to all for the help and support!!!!