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jmvotto
11-03-2012, 09:31 PM
Just thinking out loud after reading Dazes lsv mod thread regarding rear hatch size.

My 1100 surf bag pops the hatch, any reason I cant vent the bag from the rear of the bag instead of on top.? I have the reversible pumps with one way check valves on the vents! May save me two inches on top of the bag.

Boonejeepin
11-03-2012, 10:23 PM
Where is the vent on the rear of the bag? Top or bottom. A top side vent will burp the air out more effectively.

MLA
11-03-2012, 10:30 PM
What kind of check-valve is in the vent? Some require a little bit of pressure to open. This allows the bag to bilge a little.

jmvotto
11-03-2012, 10:31 PM
Where is the vent on the rear of the bag? Top or bottom. A top side vent will burp the air out more effectively.

I am not even drinking, just looked at the bag ports on WM and they are both on top..
Never mind, I must be in a fog. I just hate the way the 1100 pops the rear hatch... Errrr.

jmvotto
11-03-2012, 10:33 PM
What kind of check-valve is in the vent? Some require a little bit of pressure to open. This allows the bag to bilge a little.

It's a wake makers check valve.

http://www.wakemakers.com/marine-check-valve.html

MLA
11-04-2012, 04:05 PM
If the vent line is on the top, then take the check-valve out temporarily. This will allow the sac to vent more freely. It will not raisin on its self during draining like it does with the c/v in place, but it should still have a fairly complete drain with the impeller pump.

jmvotto
11-04-2012, 10:16 PM
Without the cv, the bags dont suck flat , with the cv it's like the space age vacuum bags.

I guess I have to get the timer right so it won't pop the hatch, I prefer the suck flat bags in the rear.

rca
11-04-2012, 10:23 PM
My 2011 does that too Joe, annoying. Did you add the check valves? I think I might have to do that. Do you just cut the hose and put them inline, close to the bag or the exterior port?

wolfeman131
11-04-2012, 10:37 PM
My 2011 does that too Joe, annoying. Did you add the check valves? I think I might have to do that. Do you just cut the hose and put them inline, close to the bag or the exterior port?

Ron,

Simple install. I cut the vent lines a few inches from the thru hull in a spot where it would be close to, and held out of the way, by a zip tie. Cut the line, slip on 2 hose clamps on each hose end, twist the hose ends on the check valve and position & tighten the clamps.

Enjoy a beverage, or two.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

wolfeman131
11-04-2012, 10:39 PM
I guess I have to get the timer right so it won't pop the hatch, I prefer the suck flat bags in the rear.

I'd be hard pressed to get rid of the check valves. Do the bags pop the hatch b/c they are ballooned with air?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

jmvotto
11-04-2012, 11:30 PM
Ron,

Simple install. I cut the vent lines a few inches from the thru hull in a spot where it would be close to, and held out of the way, by a zip tie. Cut the line, slip on 2 hose clamps on each hose end, twist the hose ends on the check valve and position & tighten the clamps.

Enjoy a beverage, or two.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

What drew said, easy mod except for the center vent when you are reaching over the sub.


I'd be hard pressed to get rid of the check valves. Do the bags pop the hatch b/c they are ballooned with air?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Nope , I think there are just too full of water.. Not air.

moombadaze
11-05-2012, 09:08 AM
found something out this weekend after finally getting to use my new ballast system, I added one way valves to all three vents. rear bag sucked down like a vacum bag--awesome results. IBS bag did the same.

this is where it gets interesting.

I got home and got the boat wiped down and stowed into the garage, all was nice and quite and I swear I could hear the boat burbing, locate source of burbs to the IBS bag that is piggybacked off the center tank, undid the quick disconects from the IBS and heard a long vacum of air entering the center tank, I then hit the center empty button, about 5 minuts later and the center tank was empty and the garage floor was getting a nice lake water rinse down. May have to remove the oneway vent or get creative allowing air to enter the tank as Im thinking a tank needs to vent to empty. Think I may add the directional valve and once the IBS is flat switch it so the tank can vent freely.

moombadaze
11-05-2012, 09:09 AM
Nope , I think there are just too full of water.

then it sounds like you are right at max fullness

jmvotto
11-05-2012, 09:33 AM
you should be able to "Wye" the center hard tank after the CV from the IBS and that may fix it . May not suck the IBS flat after it empties into the hard tank and the air lock will realease when the water gets low enough.

MLA
11-05-2012, 10:00 AM
found something out this weekend after finally getting to use my new ballast system, I added one way valves to all three vents. rear bag sucked down like a vacum bag--awesome results. IBS bag did the same.

this is where it gets interesting.

I got home and got the boat wiped down and stowed into the garage, all was nice and quite and I swear I could hear the boat burbing, locate source of burbs to the IBS bag that is piggybacked off the center tank, undid the quick disconects from the IBS and heard a long vacum of air entering the center tank, I then hit the center empty button, about 5 minuts later and the center tank was empty and the garage floor was getting a nice lake water rinse down. May have to remove the oneway vent or get creative allowing air to enter the tank as Im thinking a tank needs to vent to empty. Think I may add the directional valve and once the IBS is flat switch it so the tank can vent freely.

The check/valve in the piggy-backed sac's vent line is causing the hard tank to tin-can as it drains. The tank needs to have a free flowing vent line so it vents in both the fill and drain cycle.

lsvboombox
11-05-2012, 04:04 PM
found something out this weekend after finally getting to use my new ballast system, I added one way valves to all three vents. rear bag sucked down like a vacum bag--awesome results. IBS bag did the same.

this is where it gets interesting.

I got home and got the boat wiped down and stowed into the garage, all was nice and quite and I swear I could hear the boat burbing, locate source of burbs to the IBS bag that is piggybacked off the center tank, undid the quick disconects from the IBS and heard a long vacum of air entering the center tank, I then hit the center empty button, about 5 minuts later and the center tank was empty and the garage floor was getting a nice lake water rinse down. May have to remove the oneway vent or get creative allowing air to enter the tank as Im thinking a tank needs to vent to empty. Think I may add the directional valve and once the IBS is flat switch it so the tank can vent freely.

Did you use the wakemakers one ways or something from a hardware store? The wakemakers that i got(not the ones in the picture on there website) dont truelly create a oneway valve. They do allow a bit of air thru. I thought they called them a low volume restrictor or something. I got a y diverter on my ibs and center sac each bag has its on oneway. No problemo.

wolfeman131
11-05-2012, 04:43 PM
maybe it's an issue that arises with a hard tank vs bag?

I'm heading to the lake on Wed to see if I have any water in the tank.

mmandley
11-05-2012, 07:28 PM
maybe it's an issue that arises with a hard tank vs bag?

I'm heading to the lake on Wed to see if I have any water in the tank.

Id have to agree its prolly a hard tank issue, think about how the pump works, its sucking water out, creating a vacume, and as the water drains in a soft bag it collapses. In a hard tank it wont do that but instead it will try to suck in the sides.

This also depends on the type of material and thickness of the hard tank. It might be a thin soft plastic and your doing more harm with no vent on it.

I cant say for sure though, i have delt with the new hard center tanks Moomba is using, i will try to learn a little more about them to share but i would be leary on messing with the factory hard tank system unless you really understand everything they did for it.

jstenger
11-15-2012, 10:51 PM
found something out this weekend after finally getting to use my new ballast system, I added one way valves to all three vents. rear bag sucked down like a vacum bag--awesome results. IBS bag did the same.

this is where it gets interesting.

I got home and got the boat wiped down and stowed into the garage, all was nice and quite and I swear I could hear the boat burbing, locate source of burbs to the IBS bag that is piggybacked off the center tank, undid the quick disconects from the IBS and heard a long vacum of air entering the center tank, I then hit the center empty button, about 5 minuts later and the center tank was empty and the garage floor was getting a nice lake water rinse down. May have to remove the oneway vent or get creative allowing air to enter the tank as Im thinking a tank needs to vent to empty. Think I may add the directional valve and once the IBS is flat switch it so the tank can vent freely.

Moombadaze,

You need to add a spring loaded check valve and a tee in the hose between the hard tank and the IBS. The flow direction of the check valve would have to face the tee. There is no need to attach a hose to the other side of the valve, it is only used to bring air into the hard tank. Once the IBS is sucked flat, the vacuum pressure will cause the check valve to open and allow air to enter the hard tank, and allow all the water to be drained out. Leave the oneway vent where it is, and don't bother adding a directional valve. This way it will be fully automatic.

Note: It must be a spring loaded check valve.

moombadaze
11-16-2012, 09:21 AM
Moombadaze,

You need to add a spring loaded check valve and a tee in the hose between the hard tank and the IBS. The flow direction of the check valve would have to face the tee. There is no need to attach a hose to the other side of the valve, it is only used to bring air into the hard tank. Once the IBS is sucked flat, the vacuum pressure will cause the check valve to open and allow air to enter the hard tank, and allow all the water to be drained out. Leave the oneway vent where it is, and don't bother adding a directional valve. This way it will be fully automatic.

Note: It must be a spring loaded check valve.



Thanks Joe,

Drew and I have been unable to wrap our brains around this to make it fully automated. Neither of us wants to deal with valves or anything manuall. Perfect written discription, as im fully able to "See" this.

Just got a tee fitting from wakemakers 2 days ago and I think I have one of these spring loaded check valves at home from trying to mod the 08's system, now I cant wait to get home and rummage thru the ballast parts drawer.

Ballast mod session tonight--gotta be at least a 3 beer/3 pizza slices job.

jstenger
02-16-2013, 05:14 PM
Moombadaze,

Just curious to see if you added the new check valve and how it worked out.

wolfeman131
02-16-2013, 08:46 PM
I'm sure he will add more, but last time we talked, he was much happier with the new check valve. I believe its a simple, spring valve from Home Depot.

moombadaze
02-18-2013, 09:54 AM
Moombadaze,

Just curious to see if you added the new check valve and how it worked out.

its working good, the ibs is getting sucked down flat like a raisin, and it looks like the infloor tank is getting basically empty-maybe a gallon or two of water left, been trying to remember to have my wife hit the empty one last time when on the ramp and not much comes out. very happy with the results with something being so simple and automatic

forgot this, i first used the wakemakers oneway valve and it did not work-ibs did not empty fully, you were right about it needing to be a spring loaded check valve

wolfeman131
02-18-2013, 02:27 PM
ibs did not empty fully

you mean the center, hard tank - right?

moombadaze
02-18-2013, 02:33 PM
you mean the center, hard tank - right?


yes, center tank