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jsta281
02-19-2013, 02:26 PM
I have been on many forums where posts go sideways and turn negative, if this does that hen the mods can delete immediately.

My daughters family (x wife) bought a XLV brand new. I think it is a 2008. Super nice, and they have plenty of cash to buy a Supra or any other brand boat for that matter. My sister and brother in law recently bought a 2008 22SSV launch used, they are not loaded like my daughters other family but got what looks like a smoking good deal buying from a really rich dude that just unloaded it so he could upgrade to something newer. It is a really nice boat as well.

I have done some reading and understand skier choice makes them both and have heard the comments one is like Cadillac and the other Chevy.

My question is if you take the 2 closest boats made between Supra and Moomba and compare them with what might be considered standard option what would the differences between the two be and how much "cheaper" would the Moomba be? And I guess the other question is if you take the same to boats and load them completely full of options what would the differences be and how much different in price?

I'm a DD nautique owner (bought used and can barely afford it but it was my "dream boat" to own) so I don't have a dog in the fight so to speak, but now being somewhat familiar with Skier choice boats I'm curious where the differences really lie and how much you can actually save.

sicktc06
02-19-2013, 03:09 PM
This is kind of a hard question to answer if you are referring to a used boat. New, you can go to Supra.com and Moomba.com and get a spec sheet and see some of the differences. I'm going to try and answer it the best I can to my ability.

Supra is like the Lexus of our boats. It's the more "Luxury" line of boat and does have a deeper haul, deeper V and (my opinion) rides better on the water. It has more "Luxurious" features over what the moomba has such as (new boat mind you) power driver seat option, heated driver seat option, and several other quality things to make it that much more luxurious. It is a higher quality boat. The new supra's also come with Supra Vision system, a complete touch screen system to automatically set things such as your ballasts, wake plate and can map your co ordinance on a GPS Map. Over all, is it a better quality boat interior wise than a Moomba? that's a tough call to make, but if you look at it over all, I think the answer is yes, but that is also my opinion.

Now with that being said.....

The Moomba boat is your price point boat - Such as the Toyota of the family. You get basic things - granted still nice- but basic such as a swiveling driver seat but not near as "plush" or nice of a seat as you get on a Supra. The interior fabric is noticeably different IMO. It's a lighter boat than it's matching counterpart as far as what I can see in regards to dry weight. Engine options are there, but standard I believe they come with smaller engines and smaller fuel tanks. There are several things the Moomba's do not offer in regards to a Supra, a touch screen or computer dash is one of them. You can definitely tell the difference in the dashes between the Supra and Moomba and see the Moomba dash is a little more price friendly in same cases.

I'm trying to name off some of the key differences I see between the two boats and I know I'm missing several things about the two boats which I'm sure Drew can definite cover in much more depth and detail.

From what I can tell, Moombas are retailing in the low 50's and Supra's are retailing in the high 70's, 80's.

They are both great boats though to be quite honest with you. Moomba has come a long way with what they even had 4 years ago.

kaneboats
02-19-2013, 04:10 PM
I have been on many forums where posts go sideways and turn negative, if this does that hen the mods can delete immediately.

I think you will find mostly civil discourse and lots of information on here. We do love our Moombas but about 1/4 of the guys on here have Supras. I think what you will hear most often is that there is quality across both lines but the Supras definitely have a bling factor to support the higher price. Personally, I like the boat to be a little simpler because I don't want to visit the dealer after every weekend because my screen is on the fritz or my power seat isn't heating properly. Then again, my closest dealer is a 3 1/2 hour round trip or 7 hours if you drop it off and go back later to pick it up.

jsta281
02-19-2013, 05:07 PM
This is kind of a hard question to answer if you are referring to a used boat. New, you can go to Supra.com and Moomba.com and get a spec sheet and see some of the differences. I'm going to try and answer it the best I can to my ability.

Supra is like the Lexus of our boats. It's the more "Luxury" line of boat and does have a deeper haul, deeper V and (my opinion) rides better on the water. It has more "Luxurious" features over what the moomba has such as (new boat mind you) power driver seat option, heated driver seat option, and several other quality things to make it that much more luxurious. It is a higher quality boat. The new supra's also come with Supra Vision system, a complete touch screen system to automatically set things such as your ballasts, wake plate and can map your co ordinance on a GPS Map. Over all, is it a better quality boat interior wise than a Moomba? that's a tough call to make, but if you look at it over all, I think the answer is yes, but that is also my opinion.

Now with that being said.....

The Moomba boat is your price point boat - Such as the Toyota of the family. You get basic things - granted still nice- but basic such as a swiveling driver seat but not near as "plush" or nice of a seat as you get on a Supra. The interior fabric is noticeably different IMO. It's a lighter boat than it's matching counterpart as far as what I can see in regards to dry weight. Engine options are there, but standard I believe they come with smaller engines and smaller fuel tanks. There are several things the Moomba's do not offer in regards to a Supra, a touch screen or computer dash is one of them. You can definitely tell the difference in the dashes between the Supra and Moomba and see the Moomba dash is a little more price friendly in same cases.

I'm trying to name off some of the key differences I see between the two boats and I know I'm missing several things about the two boats which I'm sure Drew can definite cover in much more depth and detail.

From what I can tell, Moombas are retailing in the low 50's and Supra's are retailing in the high 70's, 80's.

They are both great boats though to be quite honest with you. Moomba has come a long way with what they even had 4 years ago.

Well that is what I was looking for, and yes I was talking retail to retail same year.

I can see the better stereo heated seats touch screen system with chrome and stainless accents making it a "nicer" boat. I did not realize hull design was different, I find that curious and perhaps the biggest difference. As a potential buyer I could easily forgo the "heated bling" stuff to save 20 k but hull performance would be a much bigger concern.

Any opinions on if/why the hull design is better comparing between the two?

I find it hard to understand that hull construction between the two would be significant enough to make the Supra cost more since the R&D is done and considering all the materials and molds are instantly available for both being the same company. And why would skier choice not use the same hull design (with accommodations for length) among all the boats? Why offer an inferior (if it is inferior) hull design for a boat built to accomplish the same thing?

I'm not a boat manufacturer so I obviously don't know the "why's" but that makes little sense that cost of production is so significant on a hull that they need a different "less expensive" hull for the price point boat.

Anyway thanks for engaging my curiosity I look forward to additional comments.

rdlangston13
02-19-2013, 05:22 PM
Well that is what I was looking for, and yes I was talking retail to retail same year.

I can see the better stereo heated seats touch screen system with chrome and stainless accents making it a "nicer" boat. I did not realize hull design was different, I find that curious and perhaps the biggest difference. As a potential buyer I could easily forgo the "heated bling" stuff to save 20 k but hull performance would be a much bigger concern.

Any opinions on if/why the hull design is better comparing between the two?

I find it hard to understand that hull construction between the two would be significant enough to make the Supra cost more since the R&D is done and considering all the materials and molds are instantly available for both being the same company. And why would skier choice not use the same hull design (with accommodations for length) among all the boats? Why offer an inferior (if it is inferior) hull design for a boat built to accomplish the same thing?

I'm not a boat manufacturer so I obviously don't know the "why's" but that makes little sense that cost of production is so significant on a hull that they need a different "less expensive" hull for the price point boat.

Anyway thanks for engaging my curiosity I look forward to additional comments.

You offer inferior hulls to pull people to buy your premium product. If you are hard core into the wake and the best wake is 80k you will shoot for that. If you can get the same wake for 60k instead of 80k people have a lot less motivation to buy the nicer one.

And it's not just wake quality that differs but also freeboard like he said. Supras have higher freeboard, I would love to have the freeboard of a 21V but if you want that luxury you have to pay for it.


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jsta281
02-19-2013, 07:03 PM
I see your point on the marketing aspect, that seems a bit disingenuous, but then again why make mooba customers pay for the R&D for the "extra special" hull. I understand this I spent more the I should have for the latest and greatest hull design even though it will likely have little to no impact on my ski ability.

Thanks for the comments I am getting a better understanding.

ditchsnake
02-19-2013, 08:03 PM
I have a supra and like the moombas too. Only reason I bought it new in the fall of 09 is because the economy was crap and I got a smoking deal on it. Funny thing is If I had all the money in the world I'd have a Malibu. They were my favorite boat at the show. All that really doesn't matter because I love my boat and my family and I have an a$$ full of fun on it. That is really the only thing that does matter. We use it every weekend but don't have any more fun than a family with a really old boat. It isn't the boat that makes it fun. It's the crew!!!!!!!!!!!!

jmvotto
02-19-2013, 09:09 PM
The two 2008 models you spoke of in the original post are very similar boats. The xlv is slightly longer,and has a deeper draft 26" vs 25 ", while the supra is 2" wider. The Lsv can carry 16 ppl , the supra 15. Gas tanks both 40 gallons.
Both have playpen seating, the supra has heavier vinyl and more motor options., bling factor

as stated above. Moomba = Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Chevy Supra = Lexus, infinity, Acura, Cadillac .

back in 2008 the price differential was was probably 20%. Lots of overlap back then. Fast forward , I believe SC is designing the lines of moomba and supra to be complimentary by offering different type boats in the size ranges... Ie the mojo and the SA. Very different and discontinuing certain models. IMO

Both boats are made side by side and I have never heard of either hull being inferior.

not sure why the original question was asked since everyone seems to have a nice boat and not looking for a new one, maybe just for general knowledge.

Mikey
02-19-2013, 09:50 PM
This is kinda a loaded question in the fact that correct me if i'm wrong but no two boats actually use the same hull from either brand. All the hulls between the two are different,if not just slightly.

Once you get into either brand you can have boats come in different trims yet still be the same boat or actually come as a preloaded option boat IE Mobius version of the LSV or just Moomba LSV.

Definetely Supra gets the Bling and slightly highre quality on finishings etc but basic boat hulls and funtional parts etc are built to the same specs.

Both brands are very similar in there lineups as they both have a model either way that compliment one another, EXCEPT the supra lineup does NOT include any DD SKI boats,only Moomba. They used too but have not for a few years now.

A lot of it comes down to priorities. How bad do you want "X" boat and how much are you willing to spend. Is Bling and name factor a big part of your decision or not. EITHER BRAND sells Quality boats. I've had friends who own many other brands all say they LOVE my boat and wouldn't have minded saving some cash having the same boat.. Enough said.

jsta281
02-20-2013, 12:09 AM
Ya my question originated trying to better understand what more you got and how much it cost between the two. And to the poster who commented that a family on an older boat does not have less fun then a family on a newer boat I can't agree more.

Up until this year we spent all our time at the lake crammed On my other sister and brother in laws 94 prostar 205 and had as much fun as anyone on the lake. Infact as excited as I am for my first season with my boat I am concerned that with the family going from one boats to 3 in one year that we may not be "forced" to be crammed on the boat together.

I do understand some people just buy the "nicer" boat because that is what they want even if it makes no practical sense.. I did the exact same thing I could have spent 15-20 k less for a few years older boat with a smaller motor and instead bought a DD With 98 hours on it and a ZR 409 just because I wanted to. There is no other rational basis to spend what I did for how the boat will be used, I just wanted it. I almost wish I would have found a different boat before I ran into the one I did I would have been more then happy with it but once I saw the boat I have now there was no going back.

sicktc06
02-20-2013, 08:57 AM
Try this. And this won't hurt anyone or anything at all - but it will definitely help you out too I think.
Call your local dealer and setup a demo for a Mobius LSV and a Supra Sunsport 21V, the Mobius's comparison boat. I think you will then be able to feel the differences we are talking about and it doesn't cost you a dime!

...Except when you get the new boat fever after riding on one of them! Then we might see you posting up in the New Owners thread. :)

KG's Supra24
02-20-2013, 01:55 PM
I agree with most of the points here. I don't think I've ever ridden in a Moomba so I have little to offer but I did look at both when buying.

In the Supra line up, the 21v has always been a little different. It's nose and general shape is different from the 22 and 24, which remind me more of the lsv and xlv lines. This could be wrong because I didn't spec check but I'm thinking the Supra's typically have a wider beam for the same length in boat.

If I had to go pick today between a 2008 22ssv and a 2008 xlv loaded ... I think it would be a hard choice. It will be interesting to hear your take as it sounds like you might get to directly compare them side by side.

KG's Supra24
02-20-2013, 02:15 PM
Funny thing is If I had all the money in the world I'd have a Malibu. They were my favorite boat at the show.

I think I could jump on that wagon too.

jsta281
02-20-2013, 03:17 PM
I agree with most of the points here. I don't think I've ever ridden in a Moomba so I have little to offer but I did look at both when buying.

In the Supra line up, the 21v has always been a little different. It's nose and general shape is different from the 22 and 24, which remind me more of the lsv and xlv lines. This could be wrong because I didn't spec check but I'm thinking the Supra's typically have a wider beam for the same length in boat.

If I had to go pick today between a 2008 22ssv and a 2008 xlv loaded ... I think it would be a hard choice. It will be interesting to hear your take as it sounds like you might get to directly compare them side by side.

I won't spend much time on the moomba as that is the x wife, we get along great but we don't vacation together. I have been on their boat in the water once and in the boat a few other times, I will be on the supra alot.

jsta281
02-20-2013, 03:21 PM
I think I could jump on that wagon too.

I recently was at the boat show and the Malibu was the best looking boat at the show, but would not be my first choice for a wakeboard boat if money was no concern. That would be the G23, it's not the best looking boat but its a pretty amazing "water tractor"

E4NASH
02-21-2013, 11:24 AM
I recently was at the boat show and the Malibu was the best looking boat at the show, but would not be my first choice for a wakeboard boat if money was no concern. That would be the G23, it's not the best looking boat but its a pretty amazing "water tractor"

Having the money or not paying 125+k for a wake boat is ridiculous! At that range you are getting into really nice cruiser territory. Unless someone is a budding pro or has some crazy need to compensate for something they lack or make them look/feel cool I think that boat and any other in that range is completely unnecessary and ridiculous...IMHO


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jsta281
02-22-2013, 01:50 AM
Having the money or not paying 125+k for a wake boat is ridiculous! At that range you are getting into really nice cruiser territory. Unless someone is a budding pro or has some crazy need to compensate for something they lack or make them look/feel cool I think that boat and any other in that range is completely unnecessary and ridiculous...IMHO


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I would not know what to do with a cruiser so no thanks. As for the G I agree the price is crazy and the boat unnecessary for 99% of is out there but that's not stopping sales. Over on PN it seems every few days a "my new G23" thread pops up. Short of tripling my annual income or winning the lottery I would never spend my hard earned dollars on a 125k boat. But if someone was giving them away and I got to choose . . . G23.

beat taco
02-22-2013, 10:01 AM
I would not know what to do with a cruiser so no thanks. As for the G I agree the price is crazy and the boat unnecessary for 99% of is out there but that's not stopping sales. Over on PN it seems every few days a "my new G23" thread pops up. Short of tripling my annual income or winning the lottery I would never spend my hard earned dollars on a 125k boat. But if someone was giving them away and I got to choose . . . G23.

Oh but if you had a G and that 409 we could be besty's!

kaneboats
02-22-2013, 10:34 AM
Having the money or not paying 125+k for a wake boat is ridiculous!

There are plenty of folks who think paying $40k - 60k for a boat is ridiculous. Of course, they don't own yachts. Saw a show the other night with a $4 mil houseboat. If you're loaded, $125k for a nice boat or car is kind of minor. For some it's just a business expense.

E4NASH
02-22-2013, 10:40 AM
There are plenty of folks who think paying $40k - 60k for a boat is ridiculous. Of course, they don't own yachts. Saw a show the other night with a $4 mil houseboat. If you're loaded, $125k for a nice boat or car is kind of minor. For some it's just a business expense.

To each their own I guess. However, I must say if I could, I would have no problem dropping 400k on a Ferrari 458 Italia Spider.


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kaneboats
02-22-2013, 10:43 AM
Yea, but the gas mileage . . .

E4NASH
02-22-2013, 10:46 AM
Yea, but the gas mileage . . .

Haha...now that's funny!


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jmvotto
02-22-2013, 11:07 AM
whats the old saying, "if your worried about the gas, you shouldnt buy the toy"

volfo
02-22-2013, 12:47 PM
My thoughts . . .

Moomba vs. Supra. I don't think it's a quality thing at all. I think both are equal "quality." Same indmar power, same hull process, built next to each other. I don't think a Moomba is more likely to fail than a Supra. I may be wrong.

I think it's a design and amenity thing. The boats are slightly different in design. You could prefer one over the other. I would suspect at equal price most would pick Supra but could be wrong, LSV is a great hull and very positive reviews thus far on performance of the hull in the Mojo. There is no doubt the Supras have a nicer interior, a bit cushier, have more things that are options on the Moombas that are standard, and have other things you can't even get on the Moomba. I don't know how much more one costs to build, but suspect there is higher margin in the Supras. I don't know this, but I suspect that if there is a $25k difference between a given Moomba and Supra in sticker price, you could make up a not unsubstantial portion of that in negotiations if there actually is more margin in the Supras. Don't know that.

As far as fun on old boat versus new boat, I see your point and agree that you can have a ton of fun on your older boat. BUT, come on - new boats are more fun! Not just because they're new, but because of all the new features they have that make your time on the water less of a hassle and easier to do fun things. Hulls more designed for boarding and surfing, things most people like, instead of left over ski hulls. Ballast systems that are built in, less of a mess, more reliable, quicker fill times. Bigger, deeper interiors that most people prefer and find it easier to bring along friends. All that equals more fun on the lake I think. I guess it depends on what you are upgrading from. For me going from an '01 direct drive to a '12 v drive, it is more fun. If I was going from an '07 LSV to a '12 LSV, I'd still appreciate the updates but there would be little there other than improved fill times that would equal more fun I think.

And finally, yes I bought a new vdrive last year but I still care about the gas! These things suck the gas and hold a lot of gas and at $4.49 a gallon at my dock last summer, I was putting $500 to $1,000 in gas/month in that thing when we were in season. OUCH.

I know my family had a blast in our old direct drive, but as the kids grew, that boat had serious limitations. Difficult to bring friends. Difficult to set up to surf, even for kids and me forget it. With the new vdrive, time on the water is more enjoyable and more fun for all.

zabooda
02-22-2013, 12:58 PM
There will be a time where the price of a boat and demands will entertain more competition both domestic and foreign along with innovations to reduce costs. It will be interesting when that or if that ever happens.