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jarrod_bridges2000
12-17-2008, 11:17 PM
Hi everyone new here. Well let me start off about my current boat. I have a 1992 Four Winns 180 Horizen. Dont get me wrong I absolutly LOVE the boat. This was the first boat we owned. It looks really good and runs great with a chevy 454 in it ( this is the inboard outboard ) with the OMC outdrive. It runs really good and I like it but I have a 13 year old son. He is quite the athlete. And he absolutly loves watersports. Got him skiing on 2 skis with a bar last year. Just this summer he got rid of the bar, 2 weeks later started jumping wakes, 2 weeks later hes slalom skiing and swooshing around the wakes with a slalom. Now he wants to wakeboard. Our boat is really a ski boat and has almost the worst wake I have ever seen. I have been looking around for not too pricey inboard wakeboard boats ( cant spend alot just got a new 08 Ford F-250 super duty King Ranch and 2 yamaha SHO pwc's and if i get another expensive toy the wife wont be too happy.) And Ive seen some 2003 Moomba Outback LS go for around $17,500. How are the wakes on the boats for wakeboarding? And i would like the boat to be kind of quick and nimble. My son absolutly loves the water. We live on a 12 mile by 2 mile private lake called Lake Cherokee in Texas and on that lake if you take your water saftey course and pass and your 13 years old you can drive PWC's on the lake by yourself. So Hes been skiing and tubing and riding his jet ski all summer and now wants to move into wakeboarding. ( he also thinks if we get a wakeboard boat it will have a good wake for him to jump on his jet ski :D) So sorry for writing a novel here. Basically. What are your opinions on the 2003 Outback LS? Is it a good boat for wakeboarding? Good wake?
Thanks,
Jarrod.

Sled491
12-18-2008, 01:00 AM
Lets put it this way. If you are into watersports like you say, then what has taken so long? The Moomba is the only way to go. Quick and nimble? You'll be amazed how your 454 18fter can be blown away off the line by a almost 22 ft boat with a 350. Handling will also scare you as again it is at a whole other level. Plain and simple, comparing your Run about to a tournament ski boat is like comparing a Ford taurus to a Corvette.

Trade offs, and there always are some, will be top end speed, a learning curve docking a DD boat, and rough water capabilities.

jclay5
12-18-2008, 10:29 AM
All I got to say is moomba is a fantastic choice. However if he really gets into wakeboarding and then maybe some wake surfing I really would try and find a V-drive moomba even if it costs a few thousand more. It will save you money in the long run. I bought my first inboard about a year and a half ago, which was a Direct Drive, and after about 3 months all I could think about was how bad I wanted a V-drive. the LS if weighted down will put out a decent wake but a V-drive moomba will throw down a much larger wake.

I have wake boarded behind an LS many of times and love the boat but the wake just doesn't compare to something like the Mobius V or LSV.

Welcome to the boards good luck and let us know what you end up choosing!

And of course feel free to ask all of us anything.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-18-2008, 01:54 PM
Thanks for the info guys. How would it compare to an Air nautique or a crossover nautique like a 2003 crossover 210? And you said top speed? Is it slower than my boat? My four winns is only about a 48mph boat. And i think i made a typing mistake it is 20 feet not 18 feet sorry. You say get a V-Drive? What exactly is a V-Drive? Whats the difference in the regular inboard boat? Is there an Outback that has the V drive? Because the outback seems like the perfect size boat for us and in our price range but if i really need the V-drive I dont mind throwing down a few more Grands to get it if it is really worth that much. As i said before I would be getting a new Moomba if i didnt already have this new truck, the 2 new jet skis, and the ATV's. So technically its not that we wouldnt be able to afford something more so thats why its possible for me to put down a few thousand more for a V- Drive if its neccessary, I just really dont want to put alot more money into more toys. Oh and you said rough water capabilities. We wont have to worry about that. Like I said its only a 12 mile long by 2 mile wide private lake so there is no such thing as nautral chop out there. Just boat wakes.

jclay5
12-18-2008, 05:21 PM
The difference between a V-drive and a Direct Drive inboard boat is the engine location. The V-drive is in the rear of the boat, which gives more seating room and also a bigger wake because it puts more weight in the rear of the boat. A direct drive of course puts the engine in the center of the boat. The outbacks have been available in a V-drive version since 2002 with a length of 20.8 feet, however in 2009 they completely redesigned the outback V to a shorter version at i think just a tad over 20 feet or right at 20. I'm not sure what the top speed is on a outback V or outback LSV, but I can tell you the top speed on my 2002 Mobius V, which is 22 feet long, is a little over 40 maybe like 44 MPH and that's pushing it. I usually keep it around 36 for a nice cruise down the lake. It's not 100% necessary to have a V-drive but in my own humble opinion they are far superior for seating room and no doubt wake size.

Check this out to get an idea on what Moomba has offered over the years

Moomba Archives (http://www.moomba.com/archive/#)

I can't really help you out much as far as the comparison to the Air nautiques as I've never really ridden in one. I can tell you generally Air nautiques will cost more because they are much more expensive to begin with and they are known for holding their resale value better. However Moombas in my opinion are of the up most quality at a great price. Moomba is owned by skiers choice INC. who also make supra luxury inboard boats in the same factory as Moombas in Maryville, TN.

HERE (http://www.moomba.com/history/) you can read about the history of moomba and skiers choice as a company. I encourage you to do so. I'm sure you will have many more questions so feel free to ask.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-18-2008, 05:35 PM
Is there a big difference between the outback lsv and the mobius lsv? I heard about getting the outback LS because its more of a wakeboard boat but now that i know i need a V drive so there is the LSV is the boat i need. Whats the price difference between a mobius lsv and an outback lsv? 2003-2004 models? What about size? Speed? Wake? Thanks for answering all my questions guys.

Sled491
12-18-2008, 05:39 PM
What Jclay said is all correct, but let me add a little. The DD has the motor facing forward as with a standard vehicle. The transmission is then next and then a straight shaft to a prop. Last is the rudder. So unlike your inboard the prop is way inder the boat and instead of the outdrive turning the prop thus turning the boat the prop on a tournament boat pushes the ater past thr rudder which turns the boat. this affords a much tighter and quicker turning boat, but makes backing up a B^%$#.

The V drive is as claimed with the motor in back, but the motor faces rearward with the tranny towards the cock pit. The drive line then comes to a point and v's back to the standard shaft location of a DD. Thus the name V drive. The idea of course is to move all the mass of the engine as far back as possible for greater wake enhancement. A side effect of this layout is the great big open cock pits which are great for entertaining and just hanging out.

Most DD'w will top out at about 45mph, some will get to 48mph but not many. Most V drives run around 40mph, with some getting to about 44mph.

Sled491
12-18-2008, 05:43 PM
Depending on year the Outback LSV and Mobius LSV were the same boat. The Mobius had more standard options. Later the Outback V came out as a smaller version. The LSV is a great boat, and if I heard correctly is the #1 selling V drive in the country. So lots of used units to choose from. But a used LSV will run more than the 17500 you spoke of originally.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-18-2008, 05:45 PM
What Jclay said is all correct, but let me add a little. The DD has the motor facing forward as with a standard vehicle. The transmission is then next and then a straight shaft to a prop. Last is the rudder. So unlike your inboard the prop is way inder the boat and instead of the outdrive turning the prop thus turning the boat the prop on a tournament boat pushes the ater past thr rudder which turns the boat. this affords a much tighter and quicker turning boat, but makes backing up a B^%$#.

The V drive is as claimed with the motor in back, but the motor faces rearward with the tranny towards the cock pit. The drive line then comes to a point and v's back to the standard shaft location of a DD. Thus the name V drive. The idea of course is to move all the mass of the engine as far back as possible for greater wake enhancement. A side effect of this layout is the great big open cock pits which are great for entertaining and just hanging out.

Most DD'w will top out at about 45mph, some will get to 48mph but not many. Most V drives run around 40mph, with some getting to about 44mph.
LOL thats one of the few things I knew about inboards, that its a shaft that extends at an angle downward under the boat and a rudder steers the boat. Thats why people can always be around the back of the boat without getting chewed up :p. And im a total noob when it comes to ballast in the mobius or outback lsv ( ive decided to get either one of those ). I heard it comes with some ballast but not a very big one. How much would a good weight be and where should i put them? Like side compartments or all in the back or center? And does the ballast system already have hookups in these locations? Just attatch the sac to the ballast system and turn it on and fill them up?

jarrod_bridges2000
12-18-2008, 05:50 PM
Well i jsut looked. The mobius ls I was looking at was $20,800. The only other LSV i could find was a Mobius gravity games addition LSV for $27,900 :shock:

Sled491
12-18-2008, 05:56 PM
Apples and oranges. the LSV GG is top of the line with biggest best of everything including graphics, stereo, and ballast.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-18-2008, 06:04 PM
Im not looking for the best they have. Do you think I could find an outback LSV for around $21 G? Which would be the better candidate? An outback V or an outback LS? If i cant get the LSV ive learned now that the V is good for wakeboarding for the engine in the back for more weight. But Ive also been told that the LS is made for wakeboarding over the regular outback. So if i cant get the LSV ( this is a slim chance I'll probably step up to the LSV) which one to get the V or the LS for wakeboarding?

yager97
12-18-2008, 07:20 PM
If your interest is only wakeboarding, then look into a 2000-2005 mobius lsv or 2006 and up outback V. Those are your most price point boats on the market right now, and they throw a giant wall of water if weighted right. I have over 2500 lbs of water ballast in my boat (upgraded, it comes with stock 900) when riding with 3 people, and I can tell you that it throws just as good of a wake as anything else out there. don't cheat yourself and get a direct drive boat, they are designed for skiing and producing minimal wake. At the most they are considered crossover boats, meaning ok at both, not great at either.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-18-2008, 10:24 PM
If your interest is only wakeboarding, then look into a 2000-2005 mobius lsv or 2006 and up outback V. Those are your most price point boats on the market right now, and they throw a giant wall of water if weighted right. I have over 2500 lbs of water ballast in my boat (upgraded, it comes with stock 900) when riding with 3 people, and I can tell you that it throws just as good of a wake as anything else out there. don't cheat yourself and get a direct drive boat, they are designed for skiing and producing minimal wake. At the most they are considered crossover boats, meaning ok at both, not great at either.

Would an outback V or a Mobius V be ok for wake? Cause they are a little bit cheaper. Or is it really neccessary to get a Mobius or Outback LSV? And thats the thing. My son will be doing a whole lot of wakeboarding. But he also sometimes rides 2 skis or slaloms. When he slaloms he doesent get out of the wake so the wake really doesent matter but on 2 skis he kind of goes insane when trying to get air from the wakes so a big wake may be good for that also.

Sled491
12-18-2008, 11:22 PM
V is V. The LSV Mobius or Outback are just bigger boats, but for a kid with good ballast he might find the wake even impossing at first.

jclay5
12-19-2008, 12:34 PM
Im not looking for the best they have. Do you think I could find an outback LSV for around $21 G? Which would be the better candidate? An outback V or an outback LS? If i cant get the LSV ive learned now that the V is good for wakeboarding for the engine in the back for more weight. But Ive also been told that the LS is made for wakeboarding over the regular outback. So if i cant get the LSV ( this is a slim chance I'll probably step up to the LSV) which one to get the V or the LS for wakeboarding?

I bought my 2002 Mobius V with ballast, wake plate, good stearo, and tandem axle trailer for 21,500 in July. I know you can get an LSV for some where in that price range.. plus boats are even cheaper now then they were in July. Its a buyers market so its a great time to name your price.

The Mobius V is a larger boat then the LSV. in years 2002 and 2003. Then they dropped the V in 2004 and changed it to the mobius XLV which is a foot longer then the previous Mobius V. Just look at the specs in the archives and it will tell you all the info as far as size and models.

jclay5
12-19-2008, 12:51 PM
http://www.vwsdatadistribution.com/detail.html?93722944

no trailer, but that's pretty darn cheap for a 2007 and I think I recall you saying you live in texas on the lake....

Also I found my boat on this site its a great site to find used inboards.

www.onlyinboards.com

Sled491
12-19-2008, 01:06 PM
Try "onlyinboards" . com. There are a few others outhere. You could even go to some of the wkaeboard sites as they usually have a classified section. And lastly don't forget the Moomba sites Classified section, there has been no shortage of late model boats on there lately.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-19-2008, 01:47 PM
Thanks for all the help guys. So it seems like an outback or Mobius V is my boat then?

jclay5
12-19-2008, 02:06 PM
outback V, outback LSV, Mobius V, Mobius lsv, and Mobius XLV are all v drive boats.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-19-2008, 06:26 PM
outback V, outback LSV, Mobius V, Mobius lsv, and Mobius XLV are all v drive boats.

When was the first year the Outback V was produced? Im looking for one and All i cant find is outback ls, lsv, or regular outback. Is the Mobius taller than the outback? When sitting in the water from the pictures I've seen it seems like the outback is very short and sits very low in the water and the Mobius looks very tall much like my Four Winns horizon 190.

jclay5
12-19-2008, 06:31 PM
2006 was the first year for the Outback V model. The model is I think the same hull design as maybe the mobius LSV of previous years. I'm not sure though. Yes, the Mobius I believe are taller out of the water then the outbacks.

jarrod_bridges2000
12-19-2008, 06:37 PM
2006 was the first year for the Outback V model. The model is I think the same hull design as maybe the mobius LSV of previous years. I'm not sure though. Yes, the Mobius I believe are taller out of the water then the outbacks.

Thats where I hit another wall. When I get n inboard I wanted it to be one of those ones that sits really low in the water. Looks like a little bullet in the water. But 2006 is gonna be expensive and wife will kill me. I guess I will have to settle for a Mobius. Im pretty shure Im getting the Mobius V around 2000-2003

jclay5
12-19-2008, 06:48 PM
It will be low in the water after you fill the ballast =D

jarrod_bridges2000
12-19-2008, 07:04 PM
It will be low in the water after you fill the ballast =D

Which brings me to my next question :D. What about ballast? I know it comes stock but its small and I plan to load it up but I have no idea what brand how much pounds how to put em together or where to put them. To get just a big nice wake where should I put ballast bags? Like one on each side? In the back? How many pounds on the Side and Back or wherever Im supposed to put them? Do i just take the old one out and hook up the new ones?

jclay5
12-19-2008, 07:34 PM
You need to try and buy a moomba with a 3 bag ballast system already in it. Then after that if you want more weight then the stock ballast you can start changing out sacs with larger ones. I don't think your son will need more then the stock ballast at first, but once he gets better at wakeboarding he will for sure want more weight.

sar
01-04-2009, 12:41 AM
I think that it is worth mentioning that while a Vdrive puts weight in the back that you still need weight in the front to make a wake with a great shape.

We have a 2008 Moomba Outback DD and our best wake boarder prefers its wake (with 400lbs of people in the back) over our Tige 20v which weighs more, has built in ballast and we even have an additional 500lbs in it.

Don't forget about shaping the wake!

Remember, until ~2000 everybody only had DD boats that they weighed down, and could pull Xgame tricks. Pick the boat that you like the most on your test drive for its wake shape and width, not really its height, all the height in the world will just be a crutch until you learn how to properly jump.