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08LSV
06-04-2009, 04:30 AM
Hello All. I recently purchased a 2008 LSV and am having issues with the factory cruise. First I pull up the boarder then level off my speed and flip the switch on. It takes over and we are good. After the boarder falls I throttle back and circle around and attempt to pull them up again. I never turn the ignition off and leave the cruise on. When I try try to throttle up again from idle the boat is so sluggish that I cannot pull up the rider without them sucking down a ton of water and being pretty pissed at me. It feels like you just jumped in a car with 10 year old gasoline and bad plugs and tried to run it down the 1/4 mile.... I just took the boat in for its 20 hour service and listed the cruise as one of the things that needed to be fixed under warranty (there were just a couple of things). The dealer told me that was normal and that I would have to turn it on and off each time I needed to pull someone up... Is this true? Has anyone else had this problem? I love everything else about the boat but if this is true I know why everyone spends the money on the PP. Thank you in advance for your response to this post.

jmvotto
06-04-2009, 07:25 AM
08 lsv, yep that is true. once you bring the throttle below the set speed it disengages and you will have to start over because the default speed becomes a slow idle. ( no resume button like autos have) check out page 34 of your manual

http://moomba.com/downloads/owner_manuals/moomba_08.pdf

moombadaze
06-04-2009, 08:01 AM
um, mines not working like that,

after ingageing cruise speed and then going to idle(fallen rider), then accelerating(hit it)-once i hit that set speed and advancing throttle further my speed will not increase--as long as the ignition is not turned off it wont go faster that what i set on cruise control.

mmandley
06-04-2009, 08:52 AM
Lucky you Mommbadaze =(

Mine ask like 08LSV's but mine is even more finiky

I have it turned off. I get to the speed i want, then click it on. The green light flashes for about 4 or 5 seconds and i then push the throttle forward 3 or 4inches of travel, the green flashing light goes solid.

Now when i make a turn the boat should stay at the same speed, but it doesnt it slows down and then speeds back up at the end of the turn. I was under the imprestion the whole reason i have to push the throttle forward is to allow it to have enough throttle to add power threw a turn and not lose my speed.

Now when the rider falls and i slow down to go get them i do have to turn the cruise off. If i dont then when its time to go again you cant go very fast at all.

The other issue i have is when the cruise is set to say 21 and everything is good, the rider signals faster i hit my + button a few times and the speed creeps up. No big deal. Now if the rider wants to go slower then what i set the cruise at it becomes a huge ordeal, i hit - but nothing happens and if i shut the cruise off i have to slow the boat down considerably to disingage the cruise and then power back up causing the rider to fall or take a jerking hit as the boat speeds back up.

98outback
06-04-2009, 10:38 AM
So what is the difference in this cruise control and perfect pass? If it is such a problem why doesnt skiers choice just use perfect pass.

mmandley
06-04-2009, 11:46 AM
The PP is a 1K upgrade for 1.

The main difference is the PP is digital and adjusts speeds from GPS. It also is programmable to each rider. It saves their info so you don't have to change it for each rider.

From what i understand PP is standard issue on the Supra model on up now. Pretty much any boat over 60K has some PP version to it.

I was seriously considering the PP when bought ours but since it didn't have it they said it would be another 1K and i couldn't negotiate that into the deal since i got the Z5, sub woofer and duel batteries for free basically.

maxpower220
06-04-2009, 11:55 AM
Moomba cruise is RPM based. When you set a speed and engage the switch, it will hold that RPM. If the light is blinking, you need to push the throttle forward. When a skier/boarder falls, you pull the throttle back and the cruise disengages. If you leave the engine running, you should be able to push the throttle forward and the cruise will re-engage back to the rpm/speed. If you turn off the ignition while the cruise switch is still on, the cruise will re-engage when the engines starts; only it will be at idle rpm. That means you can's go faster than idle until you turn it off.
Being RPM based, when you turn the engine will increase power to maintain rpm, not speed.
Moomba cruise is very nice for standard equipment, but isn't PP or ZO.

mmandley
06-04-2009, 07:58 PM
Yes i agree on all your points Maxpower.

Im wondering about this turning thing, physics doesn't make since in this matter,

RPM based which i know Moomba cruise is. You very correct there.

Confusion and Physics set in now.

Boat travels at 3K rpms in a straight line.

Boat makes a 60 degree turn to the port side. < right > Pressure is exerted on the hull on the starboard side < Left > to allow the boat to turn. This physical pressure causes more resistance in effect slows the boat down.

I don't understand why the RPM slows down, the engine should be driving the same speed and power as going straight its just resistance slowing it down.

I guess in my mind the prop would be spinning at the same RPM all the time but it slows down in a turn, i can understand the engine wanting more fuel for power to over come this resistance.

I guess when thinking of the prop like a tire on a car i can understand better.

Mikey
06-04-2009, 09:52 PM
I'm really not into the physics of the matter but from past experience,all of the above is basically true.Being rpm based ,easy cruise works fine for basic wakeboard and waterskiing etc as long as you go straight. As soon as turning is involved or a heavy or agressive skier/wakeboarder is involved then you really notice its not the best system. I, among others have changed to PP and once set up its really no comparison. My wife ,kids etc can now drive at the speed i want when ever i want and i/you don't need to worry about speed issues.
PP has a couple quirks to figure out when calibrating and doing initial setup but is well worth it . Its not gotten the nickname of THE MARRIAGE SAVER for nothing.
Might be worth looking into.

walk8290
06-04-2009, 10:58 PM
Problems with my Moomba cruise also - completely replaced at 22 hours. Was popping and missing and very erratic.

Still having issues with the replacement - cutting in and out and erratic RPM's. When the cruise is set and you start to pull the skier out it acts like it doesn't have enough power, then it accelerates, then slows down, and is very sluggish.

Dealer is going to take it to the lake next week before deciding what to do next.

tazz3069
06-04-2009, 11:46 PM
After I was having problems with mine, I stopped using it. Big PITA. I really do not think that it is supposed to work like it is supposed too. I bought the PP Star Gazer and can not be happier with it. I now use that plate, with new switches to operate all my LED's in the boat. Now I know it will work for What it is intended for.

08LSV
06-04-2009, 11:56 PM
Thank all of you for your help with my situation.

I have also experienced problems similar to "2008 Xlv" although not as severe or regular. I wish the dealer would have taken me a little more serious.... But I will have to spend some more time trying to figure it out.

Has anyone ever installed PP themselves to save on labor from the dealer or is the amount negligible enough just to pay the dealer and avoid the hassle?

So they really call it a marriage saver? If so I think I may just have to break down and get the PP so that my girlfriend will be less freaked out by all the things she is trying to pay attention to while pulling me. She got kinda pissed last time out tryin to maintain the speed with the E-Z cruise messing up..

moombadaze
06-05-2009, 08:41 AM
For me my issue with cruise is that when it is engaged and im reaccelerating (after picking up a fallen rider) it will surge bad when it reengages,-in fact my wife doesnt like for me to leave it on for this reason.

Mikey
06-05-2009, 10:06 PM
The marriage saver comment is quite true and can make a learning drivers job a lot easier.Someone with a little boating common sence and a quick rundown on how or where to set and away you go Wakeboarding or skiing at the desired speed you want. No hassles and You and your driver are happy. Best thing i've added to my boat that i didn't get from the factory.

jccimetiere
06-08-2009, 06:45 PM
Got my 08LSV a few weeks ago. I have 40h now. The cruise control works perfectly for wakesurfing (speed set to 10-12 mph). I set the speed (turn cruise on) give a little more throttle and go. When the rider fall, I go idle, pick him up re-engage then goes back nicely to set speed.
When wakeboarding, it is not as consistent. Most of the time it works OK and maintain the speed OK. The +/- button is slow to produce effect, but works. When I got idle, to pick up the fallen rider and go ahead, the boat speeds up ok to 12/13 and then slowly (very slowly) goes back to initial speed (usually around 20/22).
And sometime... for no reason it just acts weird: loosing a lot of speed when I turn, +/- not doing anything and suddendly you're going too fast/slow!

And finally, I've noticed that when it's a bit windy and bumpy it's far less accurate than when the water is glass.

Bottom line: cruise is not Perfect Pass. I'm seriously considering upgrading.
Any tips? Should I ask the dealer (I'm not super happy about them :( ) or got get one from perfectpass.com and install it myself?

gcnettl
06-08-2009, 08:39 PM
PP is the only way to go. It is not like the 1k you will spend will be money that you throw away. It will be an option that you can list when you sell your boat, and in turn, you will get your 1k back out of it. Actually, you will get more than a grand back out of it when you sell it.

Perfect pass can be run in RPM mode or by speed. It uses a paddle wheel speed pickup, which is easily broken, for setting speed to mph. In turn however, I always keep a spare, and they are not expensive. (35 bucks) The only way that you break it is by incorrectly loading your boat at the landing, the tiny wheels strike your boat trailer and simply break. If you are loading in a calm area then it will not be a problem, and I have only broke mine once in four years.

PP comes with an installation manual, and the guys at perfect pass are more than willing to help with any question that you may have. If perfect pass ever fails you, simply give them a call and they will do all they can to help you troubleshoot and diagnose your problem. You can order parts directly from them, and that is a plus to me as well.

The basic parts of the perfect pass set up are a paddle wheel thru hull sensor, a control module, a display, and a servo motor (used to increase and decrease throttle).

Now back to the physicist. In controlling throttle by the speed of the boat, the paddlewheel is designed to measure straight line speed, it spins inline with the boat. When you turn, you know have two components of velocity, x and y. Since the paddlewheel measures only one direction, inline with the boat (X direction), it will not pickup the y component of the velocity. The speed (X) will drop when turning and the speed (Y) will increase. The boat only sees the change in (X) so it accelerates to compensate for the change. Upon straitening up, the velocity is now mostly in the direction of x (inline with the boat) so the boat will see a great speed in result of conservation of momentum from the acceleration through the turn, and the boat will have to slow down to the cruising speed.

In RPM mode, the boat will hold the engine to a defined RPM, so in going through a turn the boat would keep a constant RPM, but as forces on the hull change, the speed will change. However this speed won't change as much as if you were in MPH mode.

maxpower220
06-08-2009, 09:39 PM
When I got idle, to pick up the fallen rider and go ahead, the boat speeds up ok to 12/13 and then slowly (very slowly) goes back to initial speed (usually around 20/22).
And sometime... for no reason it just acts weird: loosing a lot of speed when I turn, +/- not doing anything and suddendly you're going too fast/slow!

Bottom line: cruise is not Perfect Pass. I'm seriously considering upgrading.
Any tips? Should I ask the dealer (I'm not super happy about them :( ) or got get one from perfectpass.com and install it myself?


My cruise works just as slowly sometimes when setting 18-22 mph on a re-engagement. Not sure why, it works quickly at slalom speeds (which is mostly what I do).

Order PP from PP, Inboards only, or Skier to Skier. PP is a plug and play. I would recommend that you get PP Stargazer since you will be spending the money.