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KurtL
06-24-2009, 01:03 AM
So, Getting into slalom, free skiing only. I have an HO triumph with a single venom binding. It has been fun learning but I may have set myself back this past weekend.

A good buddy of mine who is a pretty good skier was out for the weekend and we were pushing each other. I was cutting very hard (for me) on my strong side and got over the front of the ski and crashed hard. Felt my front knee hyperextend and felt some mild pain. My foot stayed in the binding and hence the force to the knee.

What can be done to help assure you foot slides out of the binding in a hard crash? My binding is a large size and I'm a size 10 shoe. We use plenty of binding lubercant and the boot is pretty easy to slide into. Had ACL reconstruction 2 years ago and the knee has been great! Don't want to go through that again.

BensonWdby
06-24-2009, 08:10 PM
There are many schools of thought on this. I have always skied with a RTP and have never had trouble releasing and I fall alot.

Howver some believe that skiing with double boots encourages both feet to stay in and that it actually reduces probablility of injur because you fall as a unit. Not sure I buy that.

There are some very expensive binding systems that are more like downhill ski bindings - normally only dual boots. Lots of investigation of systems required - and get out the check book.

I am not familiar with nor assocaited with any bindings, but here is an example of release bindings:
http://www.reflexworld.com/index2.htm

Mikey
06-24-2009, 10:19 PM
I agree with Benson about the different schools of thought. Is it better to pop out or stay in is usually going to go with what kinda boots you go with,ie doubles or with rtp. I prefer to have my boots snug for the fit sake and i do pay the price occasionally with ski staying on but i've gone the other way and been hurt a couple times as well.
As for binding lube ,it usually get washed out probably before your even out of the water,so don't count on that happenening. I use it to get in then i want to stay in.
I more believe find a boot that fits well,is comfortable and has good support,then you chose weathe its 1 boot or 2.

Sled491
06-24-2009, 10:56 PM
I find regular boot lube washes out way to fast and for me this causes my feet to cramp. So about 3 yrs ago I started using Vasoline. Doesn't wash out, and so far hasn't harmed the boot. Some discoloration though.

I like it because it doesn't cause my feet to cramp and with todays High Wraps, I still plenty of feel and control over my ski. Don't get me wrong I've ripped muscles soo bad in my legs that they have been black and blue from mid butt to mid calf. Sometimes it's just the way you fall.

I have a buddy (big shot at Microsoft so no money issues) and he just loves his release bindings on his Gooddee.

volfo
06-24-2009, 11:02 PM
I have a venom front binding and rear toe plate. I have a size 11 foot and the large venom and I come out no problem on any medium or hard fall. Haven't stayed in yet. I'm guessing maybe you tighten it really tight with the draw string? I typically don't - tighten it a bit but not too much. You can definitely start with that. IF you have a rear toe plate, you definitely want to be able to come out of that front binding. One foot in, one foot out is a recipe for injury.

KurtL
06-26-2009, 02:43 PM
Guys, thanks for the info. Volfo I have the exact set up. I have never pulled the draw strings, always leave them loose. Must have just been a freak fall. All I know is that its still alittle sore (the knee) and I don't want to do it again.

Anyone know of the name a good slalom instruction video to help develop good form/technique? Think it may be time to slow the boat to 29-31mph and work on it.

volfo
06-26-2009, 04:08 PM
Mike, I'm not a great skier by any means so someone else's opinion is probably better. But, I'm intrigued by this and have incorporated some of it from what I read in waterski mag and like it.

http://www.westcoastslalom.com/

KurtL
06-27-2009, 10:53 PM
Silly question here. If one was to go to a double boot set up would the rear boot be the same size or a size up? (easier to get into?).

Mikey
06-27-2009, 11:33 PM
Same size.

Sled491
06-28-2009, 11:08 PM
The rear boot is different but still the same size.

Mikey
06-28-2009, 11:10 PM
Sorry i meant to mention that as well.

BensonWdby
06-29-2009, 12:05 AM
I have this DVD -
http://www.amazon.com/Slalom-Skiing-Andy-Mapple-DVD/dp/B0002YGCDS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=sporting-goods&qid=1246244479&sr=8-1

I really like it.

In fact, I am stuck up here at the cabin by myself for a couple days and just might watch it again.

But getting one-on-one instruction is hard to replace - depending on the instructor.

One thing that often gets overlooked, especially as we get older, is the importance of warming up before you go out.

PS
If you want to see som good -out-the-front wipeouts that caused no serious injury - check out the crash and burn video on my meb site:
http://bensonwdby.home.comcast.net/


Spend 15-20 minutes stretching, especially hamstrings and achilles. While you are stretching - visualize yourself skiing.

Hope the knee gets better.

Dave

KurtL
06-29-2009, 10:44 PM
Dave, thanks for the info/advice. Knee feeling better, can't wait to get back out. I did find a rear boot and ordered it.

Kurt

germa001
06-30-2009, 02:15 AM
I had the same problem. I'm just getting back into slaloming and I cut out too far. The water pulled my back foot out of the rtp. My ankle took all the damage. It took me a month and a half to get back out there. I figure 2 bindings is the answer for me. Instead of 1 leg taking all the force, it will be distributed to both legs and in essence cut in half. Also, having another foot in will keep my front foot from twisting as bad. As soon as I have some money I plan on getting a back binding.

KurtL
06-30-2009, 04:48 PM
Germa001, Depending on how old your ski/front binding are you maybe able to find a matching rear boot cheap. Found one in a wearhouse in Seattle for $50. It was like $130-150 when new in 2006. I had a hard time finding a large size though. Lots of s,m,xl etc.

graybmg
06-30-2009, 10:23 PM
I'm sold on double boots. When you fall, you fall in one piece not having to worry about what is going where. Plus you get a much more stable feel while on the ski making it less likely you fall in the first place. I am fairly new to slalom skiing and was worried about getting hurt and at first I thought I wanted to completely come out of the ski when I fell. But you can't be guaranteed both feet will come out. And, to me, that is the worst situation (one foot in, one foot out). I get in my boots and cinch 'em up tight now. Feels great.

germa001
06-30-2009, 10:23 PM
It's a connelly fastback binding. The cheapest I've found it for online so far is 110 which isn't too bad but I am a student with zero income. I'll probably just wait till I have some extra cash or find a good deal on it. I am looking forward to being able to get one though. It seems like I would have much more control over the ski by having 2 feet in. My back foot in a RTP slides around too much, no matter how tight I get it in there.

maxpower220
07-01-2009, 10:38 AM
Try ski-it-again.com, I have seen fastback/drafts for sale there from time to time.

BTW, I have Drafts and love them.

zabooda
07-02-2009, 04:26 PM
The 47 years of skiing I have never had an injury (knock on wood). If I fall during a cut it's because I lost my grip with the water and I slide. If I fall forward I will do a tuck and roll so the last thing that touches the water is the ski and by then I'm not moving through the water very much.

KurtL
07-13-2009, 01:18 AM
Just used the double boot this week on vacation, it rocks!!! No problems getting up! Should have done it this way from the start. Now I can actually concentrate on form(lots of work needed:) )instead of rear foot slipping out.

germa001
07-13-2009, 02:31 PM
Good to hear KurtL. I can't wait till I can get a rear binding. This past weekend my foot would start sliding out when I would cut leaving me with not much control. I tightened up the rear toe plate and it helped a little, but I think I'll be able to do much better once I get my back foot locked in.

BensonWdby
07-14-2009, 12:13 AM
If anyone cares - Andy Mapple skis with a RTP.