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cab13367
10-05-2009, 02:18 AM
Need some advise from you wiring experts out there please. I have relocated my ballast switches to above the arm rest (see pic below) and occassionally, when someone besides me is driving, they will accidentally hit one of the switches. I would like to remedy this by using an unused switch on the dash to turn the power to the ballast switches on and off. My boat was delivered to the dealer with a Gravity I system so I have one ballast switch on the dash that is no longer being used. I would like to use this as an on off switch for the three current ballast switches. It's a 3 position switch - Empty, Off, and Fill. I would like the 3 ballast switches to be inoperable when the dash mounted switch is in the Off position and operable when the dash switch is in the Fill position.

How would I go about wiring this up?

Thanks in advance.

Al

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg276/cab13367/IMG_0994.jpg

sandm
10-05-2009, 09:05 AM
one wire going to all 3 of the ballast switches has to be fused power for the pumps and solenoids when switched to the fill position. find that wire, probably hot all the time. my guess would be it's attached to the center pin of the gg ballast switches so it can send power to the fill pump when switched up and to the drain pump when switched down. run it to the unused ballast switch first, then to the 3 gg switches.

that would be my guess. I have not ever taken the gg switches apart to play with them, but that is where I would start.

good luck.. I was planning on moving my switches as well, but you bring up a good point to leaving them where they are.

cab13367
10-05-2009, 03:28 PM
sandm,

Thanks for the input but I am going to need more detailed instructions than that :) If someone has actually looked at the back of the ballast switches and can give me specific instructions, I would really appreciate it. I don't want to short something out.

As far as moving the switches, I would still definitely do it. I used to accidentally bump the switches in their original location but I wouldn’t know it because the switches are hard to see. I personally don't bump the switches in their current location because I am used to them being there. It only happens when someone besides me drives the boat and even then, only rarely. A simple on/off switch for the ballast switches will take care of the issue and I've got a couple spares on the dash (the other one being the aux switch).

Razzman
10-05-2009, 04:29 PM
Al I'm sure there is probably just one main power wire running to the ballast switches. It probably runs to the first switch and then is jumped to the others. Check it because if that's the case you just need to run the power into the switch you want to use as the power switch, then to where the power went to the switches originally. Basically you're just interrupting power.

jester
10-05-2009, 05:30 PM
Al,

The typ of switches you have is ON-OFF-ON. On the back of the switch you should have a two wires comming from the main power. (a 12 volt and a ground wire)(This is if you do have lights on the switches). These two wires are connected to all three switches.

What you can do is cut the 12 Volt wire going to the three switches and plug it into the single switch in the same spot that it was plugged into the three switches. Then on the single switch you will plug a wire in from one of the connectors to the three switches where that 12 volt wire was plugged in before. I cannot tell you what pin in the single switch you will need to use but you could test until it works.

The light on the single switch will not work unless you also plug a ground into it. This would be the same pin that is on the three switches.

I hope this helps. If you would like more information let me know.

jester
10-05-2009, 05:38 PM
Al,
You are also going about this the wrong way. You need to put little spikes on the switches so if someone bumps them they know they did somthing bad and know not to do it again.

mmandley
10-06-2009, 10:41 AM
sandm,

Thanks for the input but I am going to need more detailed instructions than that :) If someone has actually looked at the back of the ballast switches and can give me specific instructions, I would really appreciate it. I don't want to short something out.

As far as moving the switches, I would still definitely do it. I used to accidentally bump the switches in their original location but I wouldn’t know it because the switches are hard to see. I personally don't bump the switches in their current location because I am used to them being there. It only happens when someone besides me drives the boat and even then, only rarely. A simple on/off switch for the ballast switches will take care of the issue and I've got a couple spares on the dash (the other one being the aux switch).

One thing people might be forgetting.

Fuse system.

The current set up runs a Power line to the Pump ON and PUMP Out part of the system.

Each of the Ballast switched have there own fuse.

When you run the system off 1 main power switch you need to Fuse the new switch with a Fuse big enough to accept the power draw from all 3 Ballast switches because now your new Switch is a MAIN Breaker for all 3 of the ballast switches.

Not a huge deal but if you have the Main Power Switch on. Left, Center and Right ballast pumps running, now all 3 are pulling power from the same MASTER switch on your dash. It will pop the factory fuse. I think the ballast switches are 10 amp or 15 amp fuse. The switch on your dash will need a 30 or 45 respectively fuse.

The fuse system on your ballast switches will act the same as a single throw fuse but the main switch needs to be able to handle all three ballast at the same time.

As for wiring it. Keep it simple.

There is a main feed coming to your 3 way ballast switch its daisy chained to the other switches and fused at each switch.
The ground is the same way.
You just need to splice into this main power for Fill and Drain as they both need to operate off the dash to make the system Main power off your Dash.
You can Splice the Fill and Drain power together into the same connector on the Dash switch as the dash is simply a Power On Power Off switch now. Its not being used as a Drain or Fill.
Run your ground wire to the Dash switch. < it should be grounded from the factory >
Use Top or Bottom as the power depending on what direction you prefer the switch on for power to the other switches.
Ground it the same way as the others are as these are all the same style switches.
Now when you hit the 3 ballast switches and the Dash is off nothing should happen. Turn the dash on and the 3 ballast switches should work normally.

If you want any help let me know bud. Im only a few minutes away from ya lol. I have been thinking of relocating my switches too i hate bending down to see them just not sure where i want them as of yet.

newty
10-06-2009, 01:01 PM
I believe all three switches share a common power that switches power on to relays which are fused.
Cab I would just find the wire that is hot to the switches, unplug that main power, run it back through the unused switch in the dash, then back to switch bank.
Good luck.

cab13367
10-06-2009, 03:57 PM
razz, jester, mandley, newty,

Thanks for your suggestions. Good point about the fuse mandley, although, like newty says, there is one resetable circuit breaker for all three ballast switches, not one for each (you can see this in the pic). I did call the dealer and he tells me that each ballast switch as well as the aux switch is rated at 20A. He says I can pop the switch out and the amp rating should be on the side of the switch. So I need to look at the empty pumps and figure out the total amp draw when all three are on at the same time. The ballast switch can obviously handle whatever the one fill pump draws.

As far as wiring, I did look behind the switches last night and found the pos feed going to the resetable breaker then to one of the switches. It them jumpers over to the other two switches. The single ballast switch that I am going to use as an on off switch has three spades on the back that line up with Empty, OFF, and Fill - plus a 4th one that the neg wire attached to it.

So I just need to disconnect that pos feed going to the resetable breaker and run it to the middle spade of the single ballast switch, then run a wire from the spade coinciding with the Fill position of the single switch and run it back to the resetable breaker. Is that correct?

Mandley, you are welcome to come by my house and check out the switch relocation that I did. Also, I see on another post that you are going to have someone winterize the boat for you. I can show you how to do it yourself while you are here if you are interested. There's really not much to it and you can save yourself a lot of cash.

Thanks again everyone.

Al

newty
10-06-2009, 05:01 PM
You got it Cab! That should do it. I don't think there will be enough voltage going through the switch to make that big of a difference.

mmandley
10-06-2009, 06:49 PM
Sweet Cab ill have to do that man. I do still need to run my boat by AWS as they are going to look at why the boat wont center on my trailer. No matter how hard i try and how slow i go, use the winch or not the D ring never hits the center of my roller. Plus no matter how deep or shallow the trailer is the nose always hits the roller. I figure next week or the week after. Let me know what days are good for you man. I am always off Sun threw Tues.

Did or do you Fog your boat Cab?

Newty i was wondering the same about not Winterizing because my HVAC and water heater sit next to the boat. I am going to winterize this season then keep a thermostat in the garage and see how cold it really gets in there. I know when it snowed last year i could see my breath in the garage but that only means its in the 40s.

newty
10-06-2009, 08:37 PM
The first year I had a boat I kept a little tupperware in the boat about half full of water and just watched it periodically. Never came close to freezing.

cab13367
10-07-2009, 03:38 PM
Sweet Cab ill have to do that man. I do still need to run my boat by AWS as they are going to look at why the boat wont center on my trailer. No matter how hard i try and how slow i go, use the winch or not the D ring never hits the center of my roller. Plus no matter how deep or shallow the trailer is the nose always hits the roller. I figure next week or the week after. Let me know what days are good for you man. I am always off Sun threw Tues.

Did or do you Fog your boat Cab?


Sundays would work, just let me know when. I think I PM'd you my phone # previously. Yes, I do fog the engine when I winterize but I have not winterized yet.


The first year I had a boat I kept a little tupperware in the boat about half full of water and just watched it periodically. Never came close to freezing.

I have a remote temp sending unit that I put in the boat and monitor from inside and you're right, it doesn't get close to freezing in my garage either.

cab13367
10-07-2009, 03:44 PM
So I checked the amp draw on the 700 gph evac pumps and the amp rating on the switch. The amp rating on the switch is 10A (not 20A as the dealer told me) and the amp draw on the evac pumps are 2.8A each so the switch should be able to handle the amp draw when all three evac pumps are on.

I'll post some pics when I do the mod in case anyone else wants to do the same.

tazz3069
10-07-2009, 09:31 PM
if it does exceed the amperage of the switch, use a 30amp relay. that way, the relay will take the hit of power and not the switch. I have a wiring diagram for the relay if you need it. Just let me know. Good luck with the wiring project.
Tazz

cab13367
10-11-2009, 01:31 AM
So this turned out to be more complicated than I thought. Instead of just one power wire feeding all three switches, there are 5 - one for the fill pump, one for each evac pump, and one for the switch lights. So at this point, I am abandoning this little project. Thanks for the help anyway.

newty
10-11-2009, 09:17 AM
Quitter!;)

tazz3069
10-11-2009, 09:43 AM
Cab. Why not attack it this way. There is a 6 slot fuse block under the dashboard of the boat. Those fuses are for the pumps. Three for the in coming pumps and three for the out going pumps. Now find the main hot wire coming in to the block. Remove that wire, place a relay there and wire in your switch. When switch is off, it cuts all power to the fuse block. Turn the switch on and you have normal operation. Let me know if you need any help with this. It is a real easy thing to do.
Tazz

p.s. A 30 amp relay will take all the power to operate your pumps. a simple 12v to a switch will open and close the relay

http://cgi.ebay.com/Relay-and-Socket-12V-12-Volt-SPDT-30-40-AMP_W0QQitemZ200392229485QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Def aultDomain_0?hash=item2ea84ec26d

cab13367
10-11-2009, 01:14 PM
The first year I had a boat I kept a little tupperware in the boat about half full of water and just watched it periodically. Never came close to freezing.

Hey, I resemble that remark!

Tazz,

Thanks for the suggestion. I will check it out. One thing is that my boat was converted from g1 to g3 by the dealer so I'm not sure if my set up will be the same as a factory install.

cab13367
10-11-2009, 02:59 PM
Tazz,

I just checked and I have the fuse block that you mentioned with a single hot wire running to it. I didn't even know that existed, thanks for the tip. I'm real ignorant when it comes to electrical stuff so forgive this dumb question. What is the purpose of the relay? Why can't I just run the hot wire over to the switch on the dash and back to the fuse block? Is it because the switch can't take the amp load, and the relay somehow reduces the current that the switch sees?

Also, the relay that you linked to has 5 wires. How do I know which ones to use? I assume I only use two of them.

Thanks again.

Al

tazz3069
10-11-2009, 04:46 PM
Al
One of the wires on the relay is not used. I still have not found a 4 wire yet. I have a wire diagram for the relay. One wire goes directly to the battery, one wire to the fuse block, one wire to the ground, and the last wire to the switch(or switch leg. The switch will activate the relay, the relay closes witch will power the fuse block. with the fuse block now powered up, you can operate your switches. Let me know if this is the way you want to go. I will try to scan the wire diagram for you. If it can not be scanned, I will tell you what wire does what.
Mark

cab13367
10-11-2009, 04:50 PM
Thanks Tazz. I did a little reading up on how a relay works and I have a better idea now but I would still appreciate a wiring diagram.

Is there a local chain store that I could buy this relay from instead of Ebay? Like Radio Shack or something?

Thanks again for the help.

tazz3069
10-11-2009, 05:14 PM
They should. I did try Auto zone, Pepboys, Chiefs Auto. They do not have anything like that. I do not see why Radio shack should not have anything like that. Maybe go to their web site and see if they offer that relay and wire harness. You could just get the relay without the harness. I, personally, like the wire harness. I will find the diagram for you.

cab13367
10-11-2009, 08:33 PM
Tazz,

I found one at Baxter auto parts and it came with wiring instructions so I think I'm good.

Thanks again for the tip.

Al

cab13367
10-17-2009, 12:44 AM
Tazz,

Just wanted to say thanks again for your help with this little project. I got it done tonight and the relay works like a charm. The "Aux" switch on my dash now serves as a main breaker for the three Gravity III ballast switches so that they don't get accidentally turned on or off.

What prompted me to do this is that I was wakeboarding one time with just the front bag filled and my wife driving. There were plenty of people on the boat to create a good enough wakeboarding wake and I didn't want to wait for the rear bags to fill so I went ahead and jumped in. As my set went on, I noticed that the wake on one side was slowly deteriorating. After I finally called it quits and came on the boat, I noticed that the one of the rear bags was almost completely filled as my wife had accidentally bumped the fill switch to the bag. So now, once I have the bags the way I want them, I will turn power off to the ballast switches via the Aux switch before I go ride.

If anyone wants to do the same mod, let me know and I will post a detailed procedure. The only cost is the relay (about $6) in the link that Tazz provided earlier in this thread which you can probably find in an autoparts store as well (I found it at a Baxters for $9). And it's about a 15 minute job - you just have to cut and splice into one wire then connect 4 of the wires on the relay (1 to a ground, two to the wire that was cut, and one to the Aux switch).

Thanks again Tazz!

Al

tazz3069
10-17-2009, 07:34 PM
No problem AL. I am glad I was able to help you out.