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  1. #11
    Join Date
    May 2009
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    Carlton Oregon
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    6,029

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canuckle Head View Post
    Bingo on the airlock issue. Heck, I had that problem with my hand bomb Tsunami pump when it came time to drain.
    Worst i have had was a 750 bag full and the drain pump air locked on me. I couldnt get the line off and i couldnt reach the pump due to the bag. I had to keep fillign the bag to force water threw the drain pump then it finally started working. I used to get air lock all the time with my 400s. It sucked. I havnt had air lock or drain issues since i vented the bags.
    Malo <--- Means--Evil or Mean One. This explains a lot.
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  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Victoria BC Canada
    Posts
    663

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    Quote Originally Posted by mmandley View Post
    Worst i have had was a 750 bag full and the drain pump air locked on me. I couldnt get the line off and i couldnt reach the pump due to the bag. I had to keep fillign the bag to force water threw the drain pump then it finally started working. I used to get air lock all the time with my 400s. It sucked. I havnt had air lock or drain issues since i vented the bags.
    Another nice part of the reversible system is that you don't have to vent the bags, they suck completely flat when done and if by chance there is any air in the bag it goes out the overflow.

    I didn't go the timer route in mine either. I keep a pretty close eye on my bags and if by chance I forget or get distracted, I can hear the pumps change in sound when they're done. Impellers aren't that expensive to replace either if in fact you manage to wear one/them out.

    You're right about the power though. They draw A LOT OF POWER! Like 13a each and require 25a fuses. I run my boat while filling/draining as I haven't installed the second battery yet. But for the 8 minutes it takes to fill all 4 bags it really isn't an issue for me. Oh, actually a bit longer if I have to fill the additinal 750 in the seating area which I do after the bow sac is full. I have put in a T-fitting in the line and a couple of shut off valves with an extra line for filling/draining that bag.

    Got the idea from a Blog on a Centurion Avalanche Ballast Install. Kinda looks like this:

    But I have this on the end of my hose:


    Works Awesome!
    2011 President's Trophy - Check
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    2007 Outback V

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Sunnyvale, CA
    Posts
    229

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canuckle Head View Post
    Hi 08LSV,

    Sorry I haven't gotten you that wiring diagram yet. I forgot to pull it out of my glove box this morning before coming to work. Will leave a reminder in my phone so I don't forget.

    As far as mounting on the back wall, I thought about doing that but decided against it cause it will limit how full your 750's will get. I would seriously consider Jester's setup rather than mounting on the back of the transom.

    Cheers,

    Wade

    Thanks Wade. No worries about the wiring diagram. I found one that came with the rocker switch I ordered from wakemakers. I forgot about it coming with paperwork. Was that the same one you used?

    I have thought about using jester's mounting place but I am not sure yet. I saw a pic of some pumps mounted below the ski pylon on the back rest somewhere but I can't find them anymore.
    2008 MOBIUS LSV - Acme 1847, GIII w/1100lbs Vdrive, IBS, PPSG, Wake plate, Z-5, Kenwood 700U, Kenwood Kca-RC107MR , Exile SXT65, Kicker 700.5, Kicker 350.4, Polk MM651, JL 13.5 Thin-Line Sub.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Lake wallenpaupack PA
    Posts
    846

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    Quote Originally Posted by 08LSV View Post
    Thanks Wade. No worries about the wiring diagram. I found one that came with the rocker switch I ordered from wakemakers. I forgot about it coming with paperwork. Was that the same one you used?

    I have thought about using jester's mounting place but I am not sure yet. I saw a pic of some pumps mounted below the ski pylon on the back rest somewhere but I can't find them anymore.
    If you mount them in the rear lockers I would mount them in the opposite side of your surf side. In and lsv a 750 will fill regardless but when you go to the 1100(which you will soon) the pumps do block off a lot of space(weight)

    nevermind I see you have the 1100's.. def mount them in opposite side of surf side..

    I cant get a pic until the weekend..
    Last edited by lsvboombox; 08-31-2011 at 04:39 PM.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Victoria BC Canada
    Posts
    663

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    Quote Originally Posted by 08LSV View Post
    Thanks Wade. No worries about the wiring diagram. I found one that came with the rocker switch I ordered from wakemakers. I forgot about it coming with paperwork. Was that the same one you used?

    I have thought about using jester's mounting place but I am not sure yet. I saw a pic of some pumps mounted below the ski pylon on the back rest somewhere but I can't find them anymore.
    Yes, I started with that but it wasn't right for the GIII switch that I had. Let me get it from my boat, scan it and post here just in case your GIII switch is/was wired like mine.
    2011 President's Trophy - Check
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    2007 Outback V

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Sunnyvale, CA
    Posts
    229

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    Guys thanks for all the advice, I am sure it will come in very handy. Just to try to,answer all the questions in one post. I do already have two batteries and have never run either of them out of power even blasting the stereo for an hour or two in the cove.

    I did the upgrade to tsunami 800's like fman and have been plauged with problems.

    1. Airlock is the baine of my exsistence.... I have on regular occasions had to over fill my 1100's to the point I thought I was going to crack the hull just to get them to drain. It does not work all the time and even then I can't get them to drain all the way. I find myself with my bad back crawling around in the locker trying to wrestle the bag over the side to drain it all the way. My vent lines siphon water back into the bag while draining. I know I could add check valves but with all the other problems its not worth it.

    I can't even fill two bags at the same time as the pumps rob water from each other. I could fix this by drilling more holes in the hull, but that's what I was trying to avoid by choosing the aerator upgrade. Also trying to include my IBS one fill and two drains with the system is becoming a pain.

    Now I just have the whole system disconected and use my tsunami 1200 to fill and drain everything and it is less work the my auto system.

    I am over my hull drilling issues now.... I just want to get in the boat and enjoy my time without hassle.

    And cost wise my enjoyment and less arguing with the gf because I am frustrated with the ballast is worth every penny. I mean heck $100 a year on impellars it probably the least I will spend on my boat all year.

    Also I received a message back from fman the other day as I had asked before I installed my system if he still liked his system and would change anything... His response was sorry he was late getting back to me and he would not do the tsunami upgrade again. He bought a malibu and upgraded it with reversible pumps....
    2008 MOBIUS LSV - Acme 1847, GIII w/1100lbs Vdrive, IBS, PPSG, Wake plate, Z-5, Kenwood 700U, Kenwood Kca-RC107MR , Exile SXT65, Kicker 700.5, Kicker 350.4, Polk MM651, JL 13.5 Thin-Line Sub.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Tigard, Oregon
    Posts
    3,016

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    So I am at a loss as to why you are having these issues and why others report having “air lock issues” with their fill and drain pumps. I have not had any of these issues with my system. My system consists of:

    • A single 1” intake feeding three fill pumps – the stock Rule 1200pgh, a Rule 1100gph, and a Tsunami 800 gph.
    • A check valve on each rear bag fill line to prevent water from draining out of the bags.
    • An Irritrol valve on the front fill line to prevent auto filling.
    • Stock drain system – no vent lines.
    • 750# rear bags, 400# ski locker bag.

    I made sure to install the fill pumps as low as possible and certainly well below water line so as soon as I back the boat in the water, the head pressure fills the pumps and the piping to the pumps with water. I hit the fill switch and the bags start filling.

    I make sure to position each bag so that there is room for the 90 degree drain fitting to sit flat when the bag is full, i.e., I pull the bag out about 2-3” from the rear wall.
    That’s it. The bags fill every time and empty every time as they should. I do turn on the empty switches one more time on the way to the boat ramp when the boat is in a nose up attitude to allow as much water to be pumped out as possible.

    Sure, there is about a gallon left in each bag that the drain pump doesn’t get out but that’s no big deal. My only complaint is that it takes the stock drain pump about 15 minutes to empty the 750 but that’s not a big deal and easy enough to upgrade to a 1200gph drain pump and 1” lines if I really wanted to.

    I think this is a good discussion to have for those contemplating a ballast system upgrade over the winter.
    Al

    2006 Mobius LSV

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Lake wallenpaupack PA
    Posts
    846

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    How do you prevent auto filling on the rear bags? woulnt water just pass thru those aerator pumps and thru the check valve and fill the bags? are the rear bags above the water line? what about when underway does it force water into them?

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Sunnyvale, CA
    Posts
    229

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    Quote Originally Posted by cab13367 View Post
    So I am at a loss as to why you are having these issues and why others report having “air lock issues” with their fill and drain pumps. I have not had any of these issues with my system.
    Cab, Thanks for the input. I have not ever had issues with the fill pumps air locking, only the drain. The only problem I have with the filling is that the pumps rob water from each other when running together or suck extra air in from the other hoses. No big deal as the bags are vented but it takes longer to fill that way. But that is my fault since I have them all on one intake. I am definitely not trying to "diss" anybody's system. I know some people like you that never have any problems at all from the aerators. To me if I am going to go through the trouble of drilling more intake holes and all of that I would rather just make my system as easy to use as possible. I figure that if I only have four pumps total to fill/drain everything it is just that much less to troubleshoot if there is a problem. With the aerator system that's 9 pumps, not that they go bad very often but still more pumps.

    I also used the Premium clear tubing and it has been such a pain to keep it from leaking. I have crushed fittings just trying to get it to stop leaking.

    I will still carry my trusty tsunami 1200 aerator just in case I ever have the need for it.


    Quote Originally Posted by lsvboombox View Post
    How do you prevent auto filling on the rear bags? woulnt water just pass thru those aerator pumps and thru the check valve and fill the bags? are the rear bags above the water line? what about when underway does it force water into them?
    Not sure how Cab has his set up, but I used vented loops on the intake hoses going to each of my bags. I have never had auto filling issues since cutting the grate off my stock intake.
    2008 MOBIUS LSV - Acme 1847, GIII w/1100lbs Vdrive, IBS, PPSG, Wake plate, Z-5, Kenwood 700U, Kenwood Kca-RC107MR , Exile SXT65, Kicker 700.5, Kicker 350.4, Polk MM651, JL 13.5 Thin-Line Sub.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Lake wallenpaupack PA
    Posts
    846

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    Quote Originally Posted by 08LSV View Post
    Not sure how Cab has his set up, but I used vented loops on the intake hoses going to each of my bags. I have never had auto filling issues since cutting the grate off my stock intake.
    Thats the other great thing of the reversible pumps. one pump one line very simple system, no loops needed no check valves needed. no worrying about where you mount the pumps and whether there below the water line or the angle of the out put is correct... I got a few extra minutes to wait for the bags to fill with the slower pump.....

    sort of like a set it and forget it deal.....

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