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  1. #41
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    169

    Default

    Sounds like the Throttle Position Sensor is not working. I'm not familiar with GM TPS's, maybe someone else can identify the sensor in the picture you posted.
    I found this info on this online Indmar manual:
    SPN 65618
    FMI 7
    Fault Description: ETC Return Fault Mechanical System Not Responding or Out of Adjustment
    Diagnotsic procedure:SPN 65615, 65616, or 65618 on page 9-147

    ftp://ftp2.indmar.us/Manuals/Service...iagnostics.pdf

    From reading the disgnostic procedure, sounds like the ELECTRIC MOTOR that moves the butterfly is the problem, not the TPS that reads it's position.

    SPN 65615, 65616, or 65618
    Diagnostic Instructions
    • Perform the Powertrain On Board
    Diagnostic (OBD) System Check on page 9-64
    prior to using this diagnostic procedure.
    • Review Strategy Based Diagnosis on page 6-4 for
    an overview of the diagnostic approach.
    • Diagnostic Procedure Instructions on page 6-5
    provides an overview of each diagnostic category.
    SPN Descriptors
    SPN 65615 FMI 7: Electronic Throttle Control (ETC) Actuation Fault Mechanical System Not Responding or Out
    of Adjustment
    SPN 65616 FMI 12: Electronic Throttle Control (ETC) Process Fault Bad Intelligent Device or Component
    SPN 65618 FMI 7: Electronic Throttle Control (ETC) Return Fault Mechanical System Not Responding or Out of
    Adjustment
    Circuit/System Description
    The engine control module (ECM) controls the throttle
    valve by applying a varying voltage to the control
    circuits of the throttle actuator control (TAC) motor.
    The ECM monitors the duty cycle that is required to
    actuate the throttle valve. The ECM monitors the throttle
    position (TP) sensors 1 and 2 to determine the actual
    throttle valve position.
    Conditions for Running the SPN
    65615–7
    • Before the ECM can report that SPN 65615–7
    failed, SPNs 65601, 65602, 65610, and 65618–7
    must run and pass.
    • SPN 630, 65580, 65620, 65621, 65622, or 65623
    is not set.
    • The ignition is ON, or the engine is operating.
    • The minimum throttle position is learned.
    • The ignition voltage is greater than 9 volts.
    • SPN 65615 runs continuously when the above
    conditions are met.
    65616–12
    • SPN 630, 65580, 65620, 65621, 65622, or 65623
    is not set.
    • The ignition is ON, or the engine is operating.
    • SPN 65616 runs continuously when the above
    conditions are met.
    65618–7
    • Before the ECM can report that SPN 65618–7
    failed, SPNs 65601, 65602, and 65610 must
    run and pass.
    • SPN 630, 65580, 65620, 65621, 65622, or 65623
    is not set.
    • The ignition is ON, or the engine is operating.
    • SPN 65618 runs continuously when the above
    conditions are met.
    Conditions for Setting the SPN
    65615–7
    The difference between the commanded and the
    actual throttle position is greater than 10 percent for
    greater than 276 mS.
    65616–12
    The predicted throttle position calculations in the main
    processor differ from the motor control processor.
    65618–7
    The ECM detects that the throttle blade did not return
    to the default position, during power up.
    Action Taken When the SPN Sets
    • SPN 65615, 65616, and 65618 are Type A SPNs.
    • The ECM commands the TAC system to
    operate in a Reduced Engine Power mode.
    Conditions for Clearing the SPN
    SPN 65615, 65616, and 65618 are Type A SPNs.
    Diagnostic Aids
    • Inspect for a condition in which the throttle valve
    may have been held open. For example, ice
    may have formed in the throttle bore causing the
    throttle valve not to close.
    • A high resistance condition on the throttle position
    and throttle actuator control circuits could cause
    a DTC to set.
    • A low battery condition may cause a DTC to set.
    Engine Controls and Fuel - Marine 9-147
    2004 Moomba Mobius LS

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Lake Houston
    Posts
    656

    Default

    His boat is not drive-by-wire. It has a throttle cable connected directly to the butterfly valve. Shouldnt be an electric motor opening and closing. So again, sounds like the position sensor.
    2013 LSV
    2005 LSV - SOLD

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    169

    Default

    Then you must be right, but weird it's giving and ETC fault.

    Why aren't any of the Indmar techs helping this poor guy out on here? I bet they could read his fault list and tell him exactly what wrong or at least tell him what specifically to check for.
    2004 Moomba Mobius LS

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    newnan, GA
    Posts
    437

    Default

    Every indication is that it is fly by wire that would explain the throttle stick position sensor mentioned in his previous post. Would also explain the code he is getting

    2005 mobius lsv 2900lbs ballast
    2005 mobius lsv

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Lake Houston
    Posts
    656

    Default

    Thats why its giving the ETC fault. The throttle % open is not matching up to what the MAF sensor is seeing for airflow. Its a safety feature so that you can't put more air in the engine than is required. So the ecm is backing off ignition and timing causing the motor not to run right because it thinks there's more air getting in the cylinders than there actually is.
    Last edited by lewisb13; 08-20-2012 at 04:51 PM.
    2013 LSV
    2005 LSV - SOLD

  6. #46
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Lake Houston
    Posts
    656

    Default

    Forgive me for not knowing the answer to this, but my 05LSV had a throttle cable. When I went and looked at the 13LSV at the dealer the other day it also had a cable coming out of the throttle. Are any of these boats drive by wire?

    Quote Originally Posted by ga-lsv05 View Post
    Every indication is that it is fly by wire that would explain the throttle stick position sensor mentioned in his previous post. Would also explain the code he is getting

    2005 mobius lsv 2900lbs ballast
    2013 LSV
    2005 LSV - SOLD

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    newnan, GA
    Posts
    437

    Default

    Just wouldn't give an etc code on a mechanical throttle body setup. Not possible unless some catastrophic software failure occurred. Push the throttle plate open with your finger and check for corrosion on the inside of the throttle body neck or debris. Also the plate should move smoothly. Etc problems are common on gm vehicle and is mostly due to dirt or debris from lack of cleaning.

    2005 mobius lsv 2900lbs ballast
    2005 mobius lsv

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    newnan, GA
    Posts
    437

    Default

    There is also a throttle relearn procedure that the fly by wire t body has to go through

    2005 mobius lsv 2900lbs ballast
    2005 mobius lsv

  9. #49
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    169

    Default

    Santi, take a lot of pictures of the throttle body, inside and out on your boat and post them here so we can see what kind of setup you have.

    Hopefuylly you have a better camera to use than your last picture as it is too blurry.

    En Espanol:
    Santi, tomar muchas fotografías del cuerpo del acelerador, dentro y por fuera en su bote y publicarlos aquí para que podamos ver qué tipo de configuración que tienes.

    Esperemos que tiene una cámara mejor de usar que su última imagen como es demasiado borrosa.
    2004 Moomba Mobius LS

  10. #50
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    23

    Default

    Stazi, thanks for pdf, I knew.
    Why are not any of the Indmar techs helping this poor guy out on here?.
    Apparently not.
    I've sent an email to Idnma with the recording of Diacom, after being fighting with the program, we have “learned to handle it”, but to this day I have not said anything. And I do not understand why not help me ....

    The boat has only 360 hours .... but I will look if it has any dirt or debris.
    ga-lsv05 , please do not understand this: There is Also a throttle relearn procedure that the fly by wire t body has to go through.
    Can you put in other words? Thank you.

    lewisb13 said, Forgive me for not knowing the answer to this.
    Any help is good for me, thank you very much for answering.

    Stazi, this weekend I'll go back to the lake and makes photos with a better camera or video.Thanks.

    Here in Spain there are three company working with Indmar engines.

    1. - World Quality Tech only Malibu Boats
    2. - Magic Estadi only Mastercraft Boats.
    3. - Wakextreme Moomba and Supra.
    I still hope they (Wakextreme Company) comes to chekear me boats.
    Two years ago I went through the first time this problem and in the end I had to buy the Diacom program and the plug, and I chekear my boat together with a car mechanic.
    Here in Spain cost a lot to have a boat on a lake and I'm wasting time, money and the worst I can do wakeboarding.
    Thanks a all.
    Last edited by santi; 08-21-2012 at 11:05 AM.

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