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  1. #21
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    Jan 2008
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    Keuka Lake, NY
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfeman131 View Post
    So, I'm going highjack this thread . . . .

    I agree with sandm - David stated it would work, so I'm not sure how that was attacking, unless you're arguing that the "facts" you want to have straight are the independent lab results. And, to a point, I'll agree with you until I'm told who the lab is, when the testing was completed and a scan of the test report is posted up.

    I am with drew on this one, Proof is in the test results, post em up. Hopefully it wasn't jonyb who did them?


    Like to see them on other brands as well if available.
    A Day at the Lake...Priceless
    A Day in Powder...Endless


    Joe V
    2012 Möbius XLV~ Loaded & Exiled
    2007 Outback V ~ sold

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Norcross, GA & Lake Lanier
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    219

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jmvotto View Post
    I am with drew on this one, Proof is in the test results, post em up. Hopefully it wasn't jonyb who did them?


    Like to see them on other brands as well if available.
    Jonyb - I think I know where you are going with this..

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Pacific NW USA
    Posts
    490

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EarmarkMarine View Post
    Not bashing any products. Just telling it like it is.
    The Exile Harpoon amplifier has been tested by an independent lab with over $50K in sophisticated test equipment at 2 times 370 watts into a 2-ohm load at 1 kHz at 1% total noise and distortion with a 14.4 volt supply. These are CEA2006 standards for measurement.
    With quantity four 4-ohm Wetsounds Rev8s that would be 185 watts rms to each of the four speakers.
    The Wetsounds Rev8 is rated at 200 watts rms (continuous power) which is an indication of the thermal rating. That's pretty close.

    David
    re facts straight. No David, Incorrect. CEA-2006 standards is based on exactly two things. 4ohm power and S/N ratio as seen below:



    All this CEA stuff was originally implemented to combat head unit manufactures posting 4x1000 on their boxes. A lot of that has changed in the last 7 years. If you want to become a CEA retailer member, by all means test our product. It's done in a very controlled manner. David I'm sorry, but you didnt involve us in your test. Nor did you involve the CEA. They ARE the independent source.

    I've never had anyone ever think a harpoon was lacking in the power department but one thing we are considering doing in the future is putting actual birth certificates in each box so owners can see what their amplifier "actually does" as compared to spec. Some will be a lilmore, some will be a lil less power wise. We used to do this back in the 90's and people would get stoked.

    -Brian

  4. #24
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Posts
    880

    Default

    Sometimes you just don't have the good sense to not keep this going so here you go with both 4-ohm and 2-ohm power. The following is the test gear and conditions in which the tests where conducted by an independent lab owned by Robert Zeff in the Pacific NW.
    "All tests are performed with an Audio Precision 2322 Dual Domain Analyzer with the Aux-0025 filter for testing Class D amplifiers. The power supply is an Agilent 6000 watt unit fed from 3-phase service. Test loads are one-percent non-inductive resistors comprised of 500 watt for 4-ohm loads, 1000 watt or 2500 watt for 2-ohm loads and 5000 watt for 1-ohm loads. 1/0 gauge power and ground cable was used with the 14.4 volt voltage adjusted for measurement at the amplifier primary terminals to offset any voltage loss."
    Here is the link to the Harpoon read-out. One channel is less power and one channel is more power. The two numbers are averaged.

    http://www.earmarkcaraudio.com/Xcart...000.2Graph.jpg

    I have all the needed power supply (200 amps), 2000 watts of load resistors, and test gear so that I can confirm the same results. Plus, anybody can figure out that a Class AB amplifier with 80 amps of fusing is going to be challenged to get to 1000 watts.

    Now here is an interesting link on the older Exile x800.4 amplifier.

    http://www.soundbuggy.com/Eric/Car%2.../exile/x800_4/

    The Exile x800.4 was rated at 800 watts (4 X 200 at 2-ohms). And it met spec when Morgan West was with Exile (the real product guy). It had twin power supplies and get this....it had 120 amps of fusing!
    So it is replaced with the newer Exile xi800.4 which has a single power supply and 60 amps fusing (ONE HALF) yet it maintains the same model designation and the same power rating. Draw your own conclusion but I call that flat out deceptive. We also tested the xi800.4 and it is only a fraction of the Exile power rating.

    David

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    s.e. washington state
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    1,999

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    I hate to further deviate from the original post but it appears that the chatter comes from CEA2006 evaluations being performed by different labs so the quality assurance of this process will never be exactly the same. Until you have one lab doing consistant work this will be a problem and makes the CEA2006 process questionable. You need to go to the guru of testing which still may be debatable.

    I've seen that over and over except for nuclear grade components which are 10 times the cost of a commercial grade item. I don't have a horse in this race but your issues with each other is rather minor compared to the article I posted where the power in requirements will never get to the power out without devine intervention.

    http://www.mobileedgeonline.com/mobi...f-2-amplifiers


    There is no required governing body for car audio ratings. There are no testing laboratories that manufacturers have to send their equipment to. Any manufacturer can claim any power rating that they want. It’s that simple. (It is important to note that there is an industry standard called CEA 2006-B. Manufacturers are not required to take part in it. When comparing 2 amplifiers that are rated by CEA 2006-B guidelines you can get a good apples to apples comparison. Also, almost all of the reputable industry manufacturers use Cogent Laboratories in Chandler, Az for their testing and independent validation.)
    1998 Mobius
    310 HP PCM

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Portland Oregon
    Posts
    757

    Default A Simple Yes Or No?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brianinpdx View Post
    what we are considering doing in the future is putting actual birth certificates in each box so owners can see what their amplifier "actually does" as compared to spec. Some will be a lilmore, some will be a lil less power wise. We used to do this back in the 90's and people would get stoked.

    -Brian
    Having owned most of the amps on this page ( http://webfaq.phoenixphorum.com/index.htm ) and still owning a few that's a great idea. My ZPA .5 put down over 1,000 watts of real, clean power. Not to mention it was a piece of art.
    -Jake

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Vancouver WA
    Posts
    2,592

    Default Re: A Simple Yes Or No?

    So is that a yes?

    Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2


    PWI as usual...

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    De Pere WI
    Posts
    3,993

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    Quote Originally Posted by newty View Post
    So is that a yes?

    Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2
    I took it as a maybe depending on the weather in florida
    '06 Supra Launch 20SSV-gone but never forgotten

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Keuka Lake, NY
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    5,490

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    Maybe Ed G should break the Tie!!!
    A Day at the Lake...Priceless
    A Day in Powder...Endless


    Joe V
    2012 Möbius XLV~ Loaded & Exiled
    2007 Outback V ~ sold

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    s.e. washington state
    Posts
    1,999

    Default

    Only if he can have a group buy on Crocs (the shoe).
    1998 Mobius
    310 HP PCM

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