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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
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    Default Dual Voice Coil Subwoofers

    Okay, time for another newbie question. I am going to use the 5th channel on my Kicker ZX700.5 to run the subwoofer. This channel puts out 210w rms at 4 ohms and 420w rms at 2 ohms. So to get the most out of the amp, I am thinking of replacing my current Polk/MOMO single voice coil 4 ohm sub with something that can be configured for 2 ohm operation. I see that they sell dual voice coil (DVC) 4 ohm subs and DVC 2 ohm subs. I know that I can wire the voice voils in parallel on a 4 ohm DVC sub so the amp sees a 2 ohm load. But my question is, should I go that route or should I buy a 2 ohm DVC sub and just use one voice coil. Will the sub perform better if both voice coils are being used (i.e., buy the 4 ohm DVC and wire the voice coils in parallel). I really don't know how these subs work, as you can tell.

    The best bang for the buck 4 ohm DVC that can handle about 400w rms seems to be the Kicker CVR104 (about $75 shipped) - anyone have experience with this sub?

    I was really liking the Boston Acoustics G310-44 ($110) until I read that it has a foam surround. Doesn't seem like that would hold up very well over time.

    Your thoughts/suggestions are appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Al
    Al

    2006 Mobius LSV

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Carlton Oregon
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    6,061

    Default

    I have the 4ohn Duel VC on my Sub you herd yesterday Al. The Duel voice coil subs will have a very different sound if you only run 1 coil. Its designed to have both oils running. Its like 2 speakers in 1. You could run a 2 channel amp to the duel voice coil subs and it would sound good. The ability to wire the coils together to lower the ohms allows the amp to work and twice the capacity. 200W Vs 400 watts.

    I dont know all the details of the way it works but this is how i understand it. Maybe Razz, Newty, Brian can explain it better.

    My money is get the 4ohm duel voice coil and make the 700.5 push is at 2ohm load.
    Malo <--- Means--Evil or Mean One. This explains a lot.
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Des Moines, IA
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    Default

    If you decide to buy a new sub, a DVC 4 ohm sub wired in parallel would be a good way to go. Just to be clear, the dual voice coil just gives wiring flexibility and doesn't make it a better performing sub. So for example, there would be no real difference between a single 2 ohm coil sub and a dual 4 ohm coil sub wired in parallel.

    I have never used a Kicker CVR sub, but I do know it is their entry level line. If you are going to upgrade, my advice would be to spend a little more and get something that you know will be noticeably louder in the end. Just getting more power from the amp won't necessarily result in a better sounding setup unless your sub is currently way underpowered.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    De Pere WI
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    Default

    good advice ^
    the only real reason to buy a dvc 4ohm sub would be if you plan on adding more down the road, it can give you a little more flexibility, such as running it to 8ohms, then adding another wired in for a total 4ohm load. you will find that some speaker lines only offer one or the other, so you have to take what they have for sale..
    have heard a lot of good things about the kicker cvr. lots of guys are using the solobaric subs as well. you need to ensure that whatever sub you buy has a box that is optimized for it. simply replacing a sub with one that offers more power out of the amp may be defeating the purposes if the box is not designed for the sub.
    sometimes you are better off with an optimized sub/box combo and a little less power than a ton more power and a box/sub that don't work well together.
    '06 Supra Launch 20SSV-gone but never forgotten

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Dallas, TX
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    880

    Default

    cab,

    You could potentially damage a dual voice coil woofer by wiring only one of the coils. You would be inordinately working one coil with half the overall thermal capacity.

    The Polk MOMO sub is very anemic in a sealed enclosure but will sound absolutely great in a bass-reflex enclosure. I've never experienced another woofer where the performance was so polarized. In a bass-reflex enclosure you would get roughly the same output with 200 watts as you would have in a sealed box with 400 watts. So if you're sealed now, then give this some consideration.

    You're correct that a dual 4-ohm in parallel is the way to go in order to draw the full output from your amplifier. Also, I totally agree with all of Brian R's comments. Very good points.

    David
    Earmark Marine

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Tigard, Oregon
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    Default

    Thanks everyone, great info as usual.

    David,

    The sub is in a footbox that is essentially open on one end so it's basically operating in almost a free air state. I was going to try and seal it up but I think I will try to make a ported enclosure out of it per your comments. If after that it seems like it's not hitting hard enough, then I may try something that presents a 2 ohm sub to the amp.

    Thanks,

    Al
    Al

    2006 Mobius LSV

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    De Pere WI
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    Default

    al,
    think you might be in for a lot of work here. to turn it into a ported enclosure, you need to completely seal it, then add the port, tuned to the dimensions that the sub needs. I would say your best bets are to find a good free-air sub that will better suit your needs or do what I'm doing, trashing that footwell box and building a box in it's place..
    '06 Supra Launch 20SSV-gone but never forgotten

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    2,324

    Default

    sealed enclosure is the only way to go! (see newty and/or mmandley for ideas). I'm kinda partial to JL audio and there better than entry level subs and amps are not all that expensive.

    I'll have pics and posts of my upgrades before the season starts.

    Just my .02!
    2007 Moomba Outback - waiting for summer!

    Why Not? Play Hard! Get wet

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    California
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    2,840

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sandm View Post
    al,
    think you might be in for a lot of work here. to turn it into a ported enclosure, you need to completely seal it, then add the port, tuned to the dimensions that the sub needs. I would say your best bets are to find a good free-air sub that will better suit your needs or do what I'm doing, trashing that footwell box and building a box in it's place..
    Or do what Newty did and seal off a section and build a box to go in it. I have used the Kicker Comp 10's (not the VR) in a few installs and with 300-400 watts to them they sound good, but they need a sealed box of around .75-1.0cf to do it. A ported box with good power to it needs to be 100% sealed and strong enough to withstand the power. I don't think you can get that out of that space Al without some serious major surgery, more than what Newty did to his imo.
    2007 Mobius LSV

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Pacific NW USA
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    513

    Default Earth Calling Cab

    Cab Cab -

    Best advice is here is to NOT hook up one coil. This is one of the topics we would be covering in that Tek session that we should should do for you guys. Hooking up just one coil is a good way to "slinky" the woofers VC (think back to childhood of that slinky heading down the stairs).

    The comment about pushing full power out of your amplifier can sometimes be a mixed bag on 5 channel amplifiers (depending on the model). In simple terms, if all the speakers beg for max power the power supply sees / works under max stress. I'd ask the community that has that model amplifier for some input on what has worked best out there in the real world. Other times the power-supply handles the loads just fine but if you hide the amplifier in the boat installation it gets hot and tries to protect itself. I'm not trying to put you off running the amplifier hard, just have a look at the specs and check to see what people have done in the real world.

    Now with that said, my choice would be to buy a DVC, run it full power and if you choke or protect the amplifier you can always turn the gain down somewhat. Most amplifiers these days have independent gain controls. Make sure the model you own does.

    As for he box situation, let me use plain language.... BAG that free air stuff. Buck up and build a box. And when you do that, use a 12" woofer instead of a 10". Using a 12" (if possible) will offer you big time advantages in your boat because you'll have more cone area in play. Even given the same power a 12" will be noticeably fuller and forceful sounding. From what I hear, Newty just built a box for one of the guys on here. Get him a six pack and go help him. It's a great learning experience.

    And if you need help with advice on what will work or wont work, stop by the Exile factory on the way to see Newty...your right in our back yard. We can have a look at your specific situation install wise. *no crawling through our dumpster for factory seconds though

    Cheers,

    -Brian
    Exile Audio

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